Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
What is REALLY wrong with the Wizard? (+)
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="ECMO3" data-source="post: 8868453" data-attributes="member: 7030563"><p>Most Wizards I have played with do not have this spell either prepared or in their book and the reason why is Wizards almost universally want Fireball and Counterspell. After that either Fear or Hypnotic Pattern. Then finally Haste, Lightning Bolt, Lemund's Tiny Hut.</p><p></p><p>All these spells are WAY more popular than Fly (even though a few of them shouldn't be) and if you want to get them you aren't getting fly, especially at 5th level used in the example.</p><p></p><p>That is not to say a Wizard can't have fly and if she knows there will be a lot of cliffs maybe she picks it and is able to minimize that adventure (or maybe she just plays an AAracora if she knows this ahead of time).</p><p></p><p>The point is Wizards are not routinely doing that. I think in the 7 years I have been playing 5E I have never had a PC Wizard cast fly to overcome an obstacle like this. I have had an NPC cast it on party members, but never a party Wizard, and there have been plenty of cliffs, castles, buildings etc that we have had in game. Usually we teleport up them through some fashion, or climb them.</p><p></p><p>And if the Wizard is doing that at 5th level then she isn't also Fireballing the horde of orcs and Counterspelling the enemy Efreet once she gets into the caves at the top of the cliff.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>No not always, but it can be devastating when it is. There are many ways to fly in the game, this is not one of the better ones.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>A Quitzalcoutlus has 30hps, Giant Eagle has 26. A single arcer is not going to drop him to his death and if there is a platoon of Archers, then sure they might, but they also might drop the 5th level Wizard to 0 as well since he probably has about the same number of hps .... and that is in addition to making him pass a bunch of concentration saves.</p><p></p><p>Driving concentration higher than 16 in a point buy game, or getting resilient or War Caster are all going to mean he has less spells to prepare, and a lower save DC, meaning even less "godlike" things he can do, and all of these things combined will still not ensure succcess on a concentration save at 5th level.</p><p></p><p>If your 5th level wizard started as a custom race for Resilient and an 18 con, then picked up warcaster as his feat at 4th level, then you will be a weak spellcaster. The party warlock, sorcerer or even Bard are going to be better than you will be in combat and you will have a lower AC to boot.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Aaracokra, Fairy, Owlin and Variant Tiefling all have flight at 1st level.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>The four races above get it at 1st level. The only other official race I can recall that has flight is the protector celestial which gets it at 3rd level. All of these are earlier than a Wizard can get fly.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ECMO3, post: 8868453, member: 7030563"] Most Wizards I have played with do not have this spell either prepared or in their book and the reason why is Wizards almost universally want Fireball and Counterspell. After that either Fear or Hypnotic Pattern. Then finally Haste, Lightning Bolt, Lemund's Tiny Hut. All these spells are WAY more popular than Fly (even though a few of them shouldn't be) and if you want to get them you aren't getting fly, especially at 5th level used in the example. That is not to say a Wizard can't have fly and if she knows there will be a lot of cliffs maybe she picks it and is able to minimize that adventure (or maybe she just plays an AAracora if she knows this ahead of time). The point is Wizards are not routinely doing that. I think in the 7 years I have been playing 5E I have never had a PC Wizard cast fly to overcome an obstacle like this. I have had an NPC cast it on party members, but never a party Wizard, and there have been plenty of cliffs, castles, buildings etc that we have had in game. Usually we teleport up them through some fashion, or climb them. And if the Wizard is doing that at 5th level then she isn't also Fireballing the horde of orcs and Counterspelling the enemy Efreet once she gets into the caves at the top of the cliff. No not always, but it can be devastating when it is. There are many ways to fly in the game, this is not one of the better ones. A Quitzalcoutlus has 30hps, Giant Eagle has 26. A single arcer is not going to drop him to his death and if there is a platoon of Archers, then sure they might, but they also might drop the 5th level Wizard to 0 as well since he probably has about the same number of hps .... and that is in addition to making him pass a bunch of concentration saves. Driving concentration higher than 16 in a point buy game, or getting resilient or War Caster are all going to mean he has less spells to prepare, and a lower save DC, meaning even less "godlike" things he can do, and all of these things combined will still not ensure succcess on a concentration save at 5th level. If your 5th level wizard started as a custom race for Resilient and an 18 con, then picked up warcaster as his feat at 4th level, then you will be a weak spellcaster. The party warlock, sorcerer or even Bard are going to be better than you will be in combat and you will have a lower AC to boot. Aaracokra, Fairy, Owlin and Variant Tiefling all have flight at 1st level. The four races above get it at 1st level. The only other official race I can recall that has flight is the protector celestial which gets it at 3rd level. All of these are earlier than a Wizard can get fly. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*Dungeons & Dragons
What is REALLY wrong with the Wizard? (+)
Top