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What is the essence of D&D
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<blockquote data-quote="doctorbadwolf" data-source="post: 7814156" data-attributes="member: 6704184"><p>Yeah, I think [USER=6801845]@Oofta[/USER] hit upon what [USER=996]@Tony Vargas[/USER] was aiming toward a few pages back. </p><p></p><p>The magic classes need, for some segment of the player base, to be playing a different game from the mundane classes. They need to run on a different chassis, approach the game differently, and that needs to pervade all major facets of the game, from presentation, to gameplay, to how the narrative interacts with player decisions, for the game to feel like dnd. </p><p></p><p>I definitely don’t need that specific split, but because I do need something like that split between individual classes (which is why I’ve never viewed fighter as a worthwhile class on any level before 4e) and different ways of building each class, I can sympathize. </p><p></p><p>I need to be able to make two rogues and have them play differently, which only 4e and 5e have ever done, IMO. The class table looking the same doesn’t matter at all to me, because a Swashbuckler and a Thief simply do different things in nearly any scene in the game, and even why they do the same they approach differently. Same deal means that a melee pure DPR rogue and a ranged secondary control rogue in 4e might as well be two different classes for me. Because the formatting is just dressing, to me. It doesn’t matter. It’s wholly irrelevant the second I’ve printed my character sheet out. </p><p></p><p>If someone needs rogues and wizards to be build using different tools and run on different chassis with different engines, 4e ain’t gonna work no matter how different the actual gameplay outcomes of two different powers are. Flaming Sphere isn’t anything like Come and Get It in terms of what happens in the narrative or the mechanics of the game, but because they’re formatted the same, they fail the above test. I’m perfectly happy to argue about the accuracy of terminology in order to get closer to what point someone is trying to make, but since it offends others here apparently, I give up.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="doctorbadwolf, post: 7814156, member: 6704184"] Yeah, I think [USER=6801845]@Oofta[/USER] hit upon what [USER=996]@Tony Vargas[/USER] was aiming toward a few pages back. The magic classes need, for some segment of the player base, to be playing a different game from the mundane classes. They need to run on a different chassis, approach the game differently, and that needs to pervade all major facets of the game, from presentation, to gameplay, to how the narrative interacts with player decisions, for the game to feel like dnd. I definitely don’t need that specific split, but because I do need something like that split between individual classes (which is why I’ve never viewed fighter as a worthwhile class on any level before 4e) and different ways of building each class, I can sympathize. I need to be able to make two rogues and have them play differently, which only 4e and 5e have ever done, IMO. The class table looking the same doesn’t matter at all to me, because a Swashbuckler and a Thief simply do different things in nearly any scene in the game, and even why they do the same they approach differently. Same deal means that a melee pure DPR rogue and a ranged secondary control rogue in 4e might as well be two different classes for me. Because the formatting is just dressing, to me. It doesn’t matter. It’s wholly irrelevant the second I’ve printed my character sheet out. If someone needs rogues and wizards to be build using different tools and run on different chassis with different engines, 4e ain’t gonna work no matter how different the actual gameplay outcomes of two different powers are. Flaming Sphere isn’t anything like Come and Get It in terms of what happens in the narrative or the mechanics of the game, but because they’re formatted the same, they fail the above test. I’m perfectly happy to argue about the accuracy of terminology in order to get closer to what point someone is trying to make, but since it offends others here apparently, I give up. [/QUOTE]
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