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<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 7336037" data-attributes="member: 82106">Well, IMHO, that only holds if the expectation is that the player's agency is only through their characters viewpoint agency and its up to the GM to build all the world detail. At that point GMs find themselves in a bind where, if they want to make their content relevant, they must limit the character's options to those which advance things in a direction they have envisaged. Otherwise they must perforce improvise. MOST GMs, given the choice of improvising away their carefully constructed story arc, will resort to GM force (in some degree). When the characters are comic superheroes, classically of very great character agency and power, then this becomes LOTS of force. This same issue afflicts high level classic D&amp;D play, making it increasingly untenable. That is to say that after some level, say 9th, 'dungeons' can no longer really function to channel character agency, they can start to pass through the walls, break down all the doors, detect all the traps, etc. The characters then go through increasingly remote and less constrained environments, the wilderness, outer planes, etc. until the GM either 'kills them' or the game simply can't accommodate them anymore. There are definitely games, however, which can accommodate arbitrary amounts of character agency. They simply aren't going to have as an agenda the overcoming of DM presented challenges as their primary focus. My own private form of 'D&amp;D' for instance works largely like this, there's really no problem with 20th level PCs, the scope of their actions is quite large, but the issues they face are the same, fundamentally, as low level PCs. The activities of the players are largely the same too, just with a different stage to set them on and different tools.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 7336037, member: 82106"] Well, IMHO, that only holds if the expectation is that the player's agency is only through their characters viewpoint agency and its up to the GM to build all the world detail. At that point GMs find themselves in a bind where, if they want to make their content relevant, they must limit the character's options to those which advance things in a direction they have envisaged. Otherwise they must perforce improvise. MOST GMs, given the choice of improvising away their carefully constructed story arc, will resort to GM force (in some degree). When the characters are comic superheroes, classically of very great character agency and power, then this becomes LOTS of force. This same issue afflicts high level classic D&D play, making it increasingly untenable. That is to say that after some level, say 9th, 'dungeons' can no longer really function to channel character agency, they can start to pass through the walls, break down all the doors, detect all the traps, etc. The characters then go through increasingly remote and less constrained environments, the wilderness, outer planes, etc. until the GM either 'kills them' or the game simply can't accommodate them anymore. There are definitely games, however, which can accommodate arbitrary amounts of character agency. They simply aren't going to have as an agenda the overcoming of DM presented challenges as their primary focus. My own private form of 'D&D' for instance works largely like this, there's really no problem with 20th level PCs, the scope of their actions is quite large, but the issues they face are the same, fundamentally, as low level PCs. The activities of the players are largely the same too, just with a different stage to set them on and different tools. [/QUOTE]

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