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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 7338061" data-attributes="member: 42582">These remarks seem oriented towards a style of play which is (in a broad sense) puzzle/mystery solving - CoC adventures can be like that, where if you don't solve the puzzle then you lose the adventure (in the sense that you can't continue) - or, alternatively, which is about playing through the pre-established story. In an approach to RPGing in which there is no the adventure or the module, then it doesn't matter if the map is found or not. I think there are two main sub-types of such an approach. One is Gygaxian dungeoneering - if the PCs never find the map, then they don't get whatever dungeoneering opportunity it would provide, but that doesn't stop them sacking other parts of the dungeon and earning their XP.The other is &quot;indie&quot;/&quot;story now&quot; style - where the significance of the map being hidden isn't because it is a puzzle-solving challenge, nor because it is a clue to get from A to B, but because something in the dramatic essence of the situation or the characters calls for a hidden map. If the map is discovered (eg by a successful Scavenging or Perception check) then that particular dramatic need is satisied, and things unfold one way. If the map is not discovered (eg because a player never finds his/her PC in a fictional context that allows the framing of a check to find it; or because a check is made but fails) then that dramatic need is frustrated, and the resulting complications lead to things unfolding a different way.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 7338061, member: 42582"] These remarks seem oriented towards a style of play which is (in a broad sense) puzzle/mystery solving - CoC adventures can be like that, where if you don't solve the puzzle then you lose the adventure (in the sense that you can't continue) - or, alternatively, which is about playing through the pre-established story. In an approach to RPGing in which there is no [I]the adventure[/I] or [I]the module[/I], then it doesn't matter if the map is found or not. I think there are two main sub-types of such an approach. One is Gygaxian dungeoneering - if the PCs never find the map, then they don't get whatever dungeoneering opportunity it would provide, but that doesn't stop them sacking other parts of the dungeon and earning their XP. The other is "indie"/"story now" style - where the significance of the map being hidden isn't because it is a puzzle-solving challenge, nor because it is a clue to get from A to B, but because something in the dramatic essence of the situation or the characters calls for a hidden map. If the map is discovered (eg by a successful Scavenging or Perception check) then that particular dramatic need is satisied, and things unfold one way. If the map is not discovered (eg because a player never finds his/her PC in a fictional context that allows the framing of a check to find it; or because a check is made but fails) then that dramatic need is frustrated, and the resulting complications lead to things unfolding a different way. [/QUOTE]

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