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<blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 7345596" data-attributes="member: 42582">I don't understand what you mean by this. I don't know what you mean by &quot;real force&quot; and what you mean by &quot;existential plot device&quot;.I have two players whose PCs, as those players have built and played them, are citizens of Rel Astra. One has the goal of world domination. Another has the goal of becoming a magistrate. I establish a situation that forces some choices: if you want to dominate the world, you'll hve to ally with Vecna; but that means betraying your city; if you want to become a magistrate, all oou have to do is join yuor freind and his new ally Vecna in betrraying your city.Vecna is not the big deal here. In different circumstances it could be Iuz, or Graz'zt, or 13th Age's Archlich, or whatver. The big deal is the choice that each PC (and ecah player) has to make. You say that &quot;Your players are simply drinking larger helpings from the broth you have already prepared&quot;. But I'm not the one who made loyalty to the city, or gaining a magistracy, or allying with Vecna to dominate the world, salient topics of choice. The players did that.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="pemerton, post: 7345596, member: 42582"] I don't understand what you mean by this. I don't know what you mean by "real force" and what you mean by "existential plot device". I have two players whose PCs, as those players have built and played them, are citizens of Rel Astra. One has the goal of world domination. Another has the goal of becoming a magistrate. I establish a situation that forces some choices: [i]if you want to dominate the world, you'll hve to ally with Vecna; but that means betraying your city[/i]; [i]if you want to become a magistrate, all oou have to do is join yuor freind and his new ally Vecna in betrraying your city[/i]. Vecna is not the big deal here. In different circumstances it could be Iuz, or Graz'zt, or 13th Age's Archlich, or whatver. The big deal is the choice that each PC (and ecah player) has to make. You say that "Your players are simply drinking larger helpings from the broth you have already prepared". But I'm not the one who made loyalty to the city, or gaining a magistracy, or allying with Vecna to dominate the world, salient topics of choice. The players did that. [/QUOTE]

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