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<blockquote data-quote="Lanefan" data-source="post: 7352112" data-attributes="member: 29398">Like I said (and you quoted), I don't always get it right.&nbsp; But at least I make the attempt, which is all one can ask.Seeing as how in theory the players are being represented by their PCs, I'd say 'PC agency' and player agency are joined at the hip.Ah, but now you're taking a playable example (a happy-go-lucky chap who wants to adventure for the fun and excitement of it) and throwing back an unplayable example (the town drunk who does nothing) to try and prove me wrong.A happy-go-lucky character is very playable, believe me!&nbsp; Arguably the best character I've ever had was like this: her wisdom was so low that she just thought most of the time adventuring was all just good fun (except when her friends died, then the tears came); and afterwards spending the treasure was wonderful! <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />&nbsp; She lasted for years, in a 3e game that wasn't always nice to its PCs.Assuming the player was cool with that, sure.&nbsp; But if the player (in character) takes the attitude of &quot;OK, farm's saved, I'm done here - and they need help with the harvest, besides&quot;, then what?&nbsp; I'd hazard a guess games like this don't handle PC turnover quite as easily as a more traditional system.Very true.&nbsp; My point was more that character one can fulfill its goals without ever leaving heroic tier while character two has to get to epic and even then might be up against it.So strip away all that and just look only at cause A and effect B.&nbsp; Your brain will thank you for it. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />I think it's binding not only on the DM but the players as well.&nbsp; If I swing my sword at an orc and the sword turns into a bunch of flowers in mid-swing there'd better be a cause behind that: a curse, a spell, a hallucination, whatever.&nbsp; If it just happens 'because' then there's little point in playing further.Lan-&quot;this has just given me a wonderful idea for a curse on a weapon&quot;-efan</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Lanefan, post: 7352112, member: 29398"] Like I said (and you quoted), I don't always get it right. But at least I make the attempt, which is all one can ask. Seeing as how in theory the players are being represented by their PCs, I'd say 'PC agency' and player agency are joined at the hip. Ah, but now you're taking a playable example (a happy-go-lucky chap who wants to adventure for the fun and excitement of it) and throwing back an unplayable example (the town drunk who does nothing) to try and prove me wrong. A happy-go-lucky character is very playable, believe me! Arguably the best character I've ever had was like this: her wisdom was so low that she just thought most of the time adventuring was all just good fun (except when her friends died, then the tears came); and afterwards spending the treasure was wonderful! :) She lasted for years, in a 3e game that wasn't always nice to its PCs. Assuming the player was cool with that, sure. But if the player (in character) takes the attitude of "OK, farm's saved, I'm done here - and they need help with the harvest, besides", then what? I'd hazard a guess games like this don't handle PC turnover quite as easily as a more traditional system. Very true. My point was more that character one can fulfill its goals without ever leaving heroic tier while character two has to get to epic and even then might be up against it. So strip away all that and just look only at cause A and effect B. Your brain will thank you for it. :) I think it's binding not only on the DM but the players as well. If I swing my sword at an orc and the sword turns into a bunch of flowers in mid-swing there'd better be a cause behind that: a curse, a spell, a hallucination, whatever. If it just happens 'because' then there's little point in playing further. Lan-"this has just given me a wonderful idea for a curse on a weapon"-efan [/QUOTE]

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