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<blockquote data-quote="Lanefan" data-source="post: 7377811" data-attributes="member: 29398">For added simplicity let's assume the PC is already in the market square, and declares this action: &quot;I check with such merchants as might be expected to sell such things to determine if there's a holy sword for sale.&nbsp; If there is, I buy it.&quot;&nbsp;&nbsp; In story now, as far as I can tell a success on the die roll means the PC walks out with a holy sword (and, one assumes, a lighter wallet).&nbsp; The only recourse the DM has if she thinks a holy sword is overkill for that party or PC in terms of game or character balance is to set an unachievably high DC on finding one - but that's just using more words and dice to say 'no', which ain't allowed.The thing is, some of these guys have hard-tied their view of what constitutes player agency to how much input* the player has to the 'shared fiction' and either minimize or dismiss all other types of agency, then go on to say or imply that players in a typical non-4e D&amp;D game don't really have any agency.&nbsp; As you may have already concluded if you've read all the 1400-ish posts so far, I disagree with this view. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />* - be it input from a successful action declaration or straight-on authorship.When I read Eero's treatise I came away with pretty much the same thoughts on it that you did; only you stated yours better and more clearly: it seems to be advocating away from player input into the fiction, and for the setting and background to be left to the DM.The whole question around the benefits and drawbacks of &quot;go where the action is&quot;, which Eero also advocates, is another headache entirely; potentially impacting a different type of player agency considered lesser by some but important by me.Lan-&quot;why do I want to go where the action is when I can instead just sneak around it all and steal the treasure while everyone else is busy&quot;-efan</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Lanefan, post: 7377811, member: 29398"] For added simplicity let's assume the PC is already in the market square, and declares this action: "I check with such merchants as might be expected to sell such things to determine if there's a holy sword for sale. If there is, I buy it." In story now, as far as I can tell a success on the die roll means the PC walks out with a holy sword (and, one assumes, a lighter wallet). The only recourse the DM has if she thinks a holy sword is overkill for that party or PC in terms of game or character balance is to set an unachievably high DC on finding one - but that's just using more words and dice to say 'no', which ain't allowed. The thing is, some of these guys have hard-tied their view of what constitutes player agency to how much input* the player has to the 'shared fiction' and either minimize or dismiss all other types of agency, then go on to say or imply that players in a typical non-4e D&D game don't really have any agency. As you may have already concluded if you've read all the 1400-ish posts so far, I disagree with this view. :) * - be it input from a successful action declaration or straight-on authorship. When I read Eero's treatise I came away with pretty much the same thoughts on it that you did; only you stated yours better and more clearly: it seems to be advocating away from player input into the fiction, and for the setting and background to be left to the DM. The whole question around the benefits and drawbacks of "go where the action is", which Eero also advocates, is another headache entirely; potentially impacting a different type of player agency considered lesser by some but important by me. Lan-"why do I want to go where the action is when I can instead just sneak around it all and steal the treasure while everyone else is busy"-efan [/QUOTE]

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