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<blockquote data-quote="Lanefan" data-source="post: 7378651" data-attributes="member: 29398">Still kinda ruins the setup, though; if for no other reason than the party sneak doesn't get a chance to do her thing with some stealthy scouting.&nbsp; The pre-frame of increasing heat and smoky smell, followed by a chance to prepare and-or pre-scout is the far better option IMO.&nbsp; Fair enough; some of the examples I've tossed out in this thread have been similarly off-the-cuff.&nbsp; But the point remains, it's too fast of a jump-shift.All that's needed is for the players to say to the DM &quot;Tell us if we see anything unusual or interesting along the way&quot;; or for the DM to simply do this unprompted, as standard procedure.Ditto.Which is part of my issue - it seems in some of the examples we've seen that the players/PCs aren't always getting the chance to say/do these things.&nbsp; The giants one is, as we've seen, a rather obvious case in point.&nbsp; The reliquary one is another - no chance given to find a different or more stealthy approach, no chance given to pre-scout or pre-buff, and so on...though in fairness we don't really know how much the guiding angels had to do with that in the actual run of play whose log we've seen.&nbsp; I mean, if they just marched the PCs up to the reliquary entrance without so much as a by-your-leave then the PCs are kinda stuck with that, and so be it.Lanefan</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Lanefan, post: 7378651, member: 29398"] Still kinda ruins the setup, though; if for no other reason than the party sneak doesn't get a chance to do her thing with some stealthy scouting. The pre-frame of increasing heat and smoky smell, followed by a chance to prepare and-or pre-scout is the far better option IMO. Fair enough; some of the examples I've tossed out in this thread have been similarly off-the-cuff. But the point remains, it's too fast of a jump-shift. All that's needed is for the players to say to the DM "Tell us if we see anything unusual or interesting along the way"; or for the DM to simply do this unprompted, as standard procedure. Ditto. Which is part of my issue - it seems in some of the examples we've seen that the players/PCs aren't always getting the chance to say/do these things. The giants one is, as we've seen, a rather obvious case in point. The reliquary one is another - no chance given to find a different or more stealthy approach, no chance given to pre-scout or pre-buff, and so on...though in fairness we don't really know how much the guiding angels had to do with that in the actual run of play whose log we've seen. I mean, if they just marched the PCs up to the reliquary entrance without so much as a by-your-leave then the PCs are kinda stuck with that, and so be it. Lanefan [/QUOTE]

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