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<blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 7394910" data-attributes="member: 82106">I believe this is all still thinking subtly in 'classic' RPG methodology terms. What if the player fails the check? Then, as [MENTION=42582]pemerton[/MENTION] says, just saying &quot;eh, no door here!&quot; is 'weaksauce'. No, the GM is going to introduce another problem. Heck, maybe there IS still a secret door, you really want to open it???!!! Even on a success I could easily narrate &quot;Ok, the narrow door opens onto a cramped passageway which appears to slope steeply downward into darkness. A foul musty odor wafts past you, and the angles of the ceiling are tufted with cobwebs and spiders...&quot;As our previous discussion of this point elucidated, there has to be something more than a single shake of a die which leads to utter unfettered success of the character for the whole rest of the narrative. Clearly that's just not how these things work. When you have a success you move somewhat closer to your goal. Now you have one guard to surprise instead of 2 guards to defeat in a frontal battle. You're still better off. Just as you would be better off if you took out your bow and slew one of those two guards with a successful attack (you see, attack roll and perception check are now equivalently balanced forward advances).As I pointed out just before this in another post, there's really no likelihood that one path is just as hard as another. Difficulty isn't even the REAL focus here, but if everything was equally hard/easy then there would be no point in choosing, at least from a perspective of 'winning'.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="AbdulAlhazred, post: 7394910, member: 82106"] I believe this is all still thinking subtly in 'classic' RPG methodology terms. What if the player fails the check? Then, as [MENTION=42582]pemerton[/MENTION] says, just saying "eh, no door here!" is 'weaksauce'. No, the GM is going to introduce another problem. Heck, maybe there IS still a secret door, you really want to open it???!!! Even on a success I could easily narrate "Ok, the narrow door opens onto a cramped passageway which appears to slope steeply downward into darkness. A foul musty odor wafts past you, and the angles of the ceiling are tufted with cobwebs and spiders..." As our previous discussion of this point elucidated, there has to be something more than a single shake of a die which leads to utter unfettered success of the character for the whole rest of the narrative. Clearly that's just not how these things work. When you have a success you move somewhat closer to your goal. Now you have one guard to surprise instead of 2 guards to defeat in a frontal battle. You're still better off. Just as you would be better off if you took out your bow and slew one of those two guards with a successful attack (you see, attack roll and perception check are now equivalently balanced forward advances). As I pointed out just before this in another post, there's really no likelihood that one path is just as hard as another. Difficulty isn't even the REAL focus here, but if everything was equally hard/easy then there would be no point in choosing, at least from a perspective of 'winning'. [/QUOTE]

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