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<blockquote data-quote="hawkeyefan" data-source="post: 7407583" data-attributes="member: 6785785">Let’s not add details to the example. I can just as easily add details that would suit my purposes.Instead, let’s just work with the original example. Based on that, do you not understand the criticism?No, that’s not what I said. I said that the scenario as described seem to serve no other purpose than to be a gotcha moment. Perhaps it could serve some other purpose depending on other relevant details, like your bit above about the wild mage. I generally don’t like such “gotcha” moments. I think if you’re going to have something like that, then you need to give the players a chance to discover it or be aware that such bizarre effects might exist. Obviously your definition varies. But hasn’t the alternate view of agency been made clear? The lack of even a chance at success based solely on what the DM has decided ahead of time is what’s being cited. Call it agency or something else, do you get the complaint? The concern is about the play experience more than preserving the DM’s predetermined lore. What’s more important, that the player be able to succeed orfail based on his decisions, or that a wild mage lived in the area 1,000 years ago? Different people will answer that question differently, but I don’t really see how choosing one answer means you cannot understand the other one.For me, I don’t think I’d consider every possible example of this as a negative. I’m sure we could come up with examples of predetermined lore that I would prefer remain intact. But with the example given, to let it play out as described, I would need a really compelling reason for the forcefield to be there.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="hawkeyefan, post: 7407583, member: 6785785"] Let’s not add details to the example. I can just as easily add details that would suit my purposes. Instead, let’s just work with the original example. Based on that, do you not understand the criticism? No, that’s not what I said. I said that the scenario as described seem to serve no other purpose than to be a gotcha moment. Perhaps it could serve some other purpose depending on other relevant details, like your bit above about the wild mage. I generally don’t like such “gotcha” moments. I think if you’re going to have something like that, then you need to give the players a chance to discover it or be aware that such bizarre effects might exist. Obviously your definition varies. But hasn’t the alternate view of agency been made clear? The lack of even a chance at success based solely on what the DM has decided ahead of time is what’s being cited. Call it agency or something else, do you get the complaint? The concern is about the play experience more than preserving the DM’s predetermined lore. What’s more important, that the player be able to succeed orfail based on his decisions, or that a wild mage lived in the area 1,000 years ago? Different people will answer that question differently, but I don’t really see how choosing one answer means you cannot understand the other one. For me, I don’t think I’d consider every possible example of this as a negative. I’m sure we could come up with examples of predetermined lore that I would prefer remain intact. But with the example given, to let it play out as described, I would need a really compelling reason for the forcefield to be there. [/QUOTE]

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