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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Maxperson" data-source="post: 7407593" data-attributes="member: 23751">You asked me what else could be causing that than DM desire, so I provided a cause.  If you don't wish to use that cause, and want to just go with the original example, then you need to accept that I also said that it wasn't DM desire, because I don't take actions on my personal desires to thwart players.The scenario above also didn't involve DM desire since I said it didn't, but you didn't accept that.  The detail was only added afterward since you asked me what else it could be, and because in my game there would be some sort of reason for the wall of force to be there.  I didn't expect that you would pick and choose from the scenario I provided and just toss out the part where I said that there was no DM desire involved, so I didn't think I needed more detail in that post.As I said in another recent post.  A gotcha has to be something severe, like the medusa example or something else major.  A bit of humor as we have a Wile E. Coyote moment at a ditch isn't a gotcha, and that's assuming that there is no way to discover it prior to the leap, which there usually is.As I am pointing out to @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=42582" target="_blank">pemerton</a> right now, it's an irrelevant complaint as the only way it is even remotely an issue is if the two definitions are being mixed in a single game, which just won't happen.  Otherwise, agency is 100% in both playstyles and it's kinda useless in my opinion to complain about something happening in someone else's game, and which has no bearing on either you or your game.It's false to say that my way has less agency than @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=42582" target="_blank">pemerton</a>'s way, as the two aren't in a position to be used together.  It's an apples and oranges situation.Objectively?  Neither one.  Subjectively?  It's not really relevant here since we aren't playing in each others games AND trying to mix the definitions.  Were I to play in @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=42582" target="_blank">pemerton</a>'s game, I would do my best to play in his playstyle with his definition, since I would be being an asshat if I went to a game like that and tried to play my way.</blockquote>

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