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What is your oppinion of 5.24 so far?
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<blockquote data-quote="Bacon Bits" data-source="post: 9408065" data-attributes="member: 6777737"><p>Sorry for the delayed response. I simply can't participate here as often as others.</p><p></p><p>For the most part, things that I want addressed were unlikely to <em>ever</em> be addressed in the first place with a point revision. I know that, but it doesn't fix the problems as I see them.</p><p></p><p>The biggest issue is <em>deeply systemic</em>. Long rests are extremely powerful, and the result of that is that short-rest dependent classes suck <em>and</em> people think the encounter system is broken. The trouble is that the biggest sticks to deter long resting -- time pressure, ambushes, or gritty realism recovery -- either put the game on rails or change the style of play. If the game isn't flexible enough to not be on rails and not be a hex crawl/dungeon crawl, then it's not a very good TTRPG. The game needs something to <em>reward <strong>not</strong> long resting</em>. But I really, really doubt they did that. They did partially address it by backing off how much some classes rely on short rests, but of course Warlock (AFAIK) got reverted to Pact Magic. So... yeah, probably not fixed.</p><p></p><p>Second foremost is higher level spells. I explained my problems with them well in <a href="https://www.enworld.org/threads/what-do-you-expect-hope-to-see-in-future-playtest-packets.690997/page-10#post-9030184" target="_blank">this earlier thread</a>.</p><p></p><p>Thirdly, is polymorph and summon effects. This looks like it was <em>partially</em> addressed, but my experience is still that without fixed stats or a fixed list of targets the results are going to continue to slow the game down a lot and be really unbalanced. I think they could address this issue more easily with an ally rating to compliment the CR that tells you the level of the creature as an ally. But from what we've seen a lot of these effects are unchanged from 5e, so I'm really expecting these changes to fail. I know people like that the work this way, but that doesn't mean it's possible to balance. If Animate Objects and Polymorph are unchanged I'm going to have to replace the naugahyde on the arms of this chair, because I just have a gut feeling they completely overlooked one or the other.</p><p></p><p>Fourth is mostly the DMing aspects. And I don't mean what everyone seems to endlessly complain about, which is to say, NOT the encounter system or monsters. I think the encounter system isn't really that bad. The presentation <em>sucks</em> and it needs to explain that YES you're fully supposed to use CR 19s against a 13th level party instead of relying on people to do the math, but it works well enough. I think the monster problem can be solved pretty easily with third party content if nothing else. No, the big DMG problem is, "How do I, as a DM, run a campaign that gets the PCs to want to solve their problems by going on adventures and quests that THEY invent the goals for." I think the DMG instructs you how on to run a game, but it doesn't <strong>teach you how to be a DM</strong>. I think the 1e DMG for all it's extensive and manifold flaws is a better work in this respect.</p><p></p><p>It's even more frustrating because many of the things they <em>are </em>fixing in 5e.24 -- like Paladin smite spam -- were clearly known issues by 2016 and they could have issued recommendations then. Like they're totally self-contained issues, and then they spent the two years they had on <em>thoroughly not addressing systemic problems</em>. Like they're trying to fix martial-caster disparity with weapon mastery, and (a) no, it doesn't, and (b) it's slowing the game down even more. Words cannot express how much I don't want to roll a saving throw vs topple again, while other masteries like nick should <em>just be how the game works</em>.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Bacon Bits, post: 9408065, member: 6777737"] Sorry for the delayed response. I simply can't participate here as often as others. For the most part, things that I want addressed were unlikely to [I]ever[/I] be addressed in the first place with a point revision. I know that, but it doesn't fix the problems as I see them. The biggest issue is [I]deeply systemic[/I]. Long rests are extremely powerful, and the result of that is that short-rest dependent classes suck [I]and[/I] people think the encounter system is broken. The trouble is that the biggest sticks to deter long resting -- time pressure, ambushes, or gritty realism recovery -- either put the game on rails or change the style of play. If the game isn't flexible enough to not be on rails and not be a hex crawl/dungeon crawl, then it's not a very good TTRPG. The game needs something to [I]reward [B]not[/B] long resting[/I]. But I really, really doubt they did that. They did partially address it by backing off how much some classes rely on short rests, but of course Warlock (AFAIK) got reverted to Pact Magic. So... yeah, probably not fixed. Second foremost is higher level spells. I explained my problems with them well in [URL='https://www.enworld.org/threads/what-do-you-expect-hope-to-see-in-future-playtest-packets.690997/page-10#post-9030184']this earlier thread[/URL]. Thirdly, is polymorph and summon effects. This looks like it was [I]partially[/I] addressed, but my experience is still that without fixed stats or a fixed list of targets the results are going to continue to slow the game down a lot and be really unbalanced. I think they could address this issue more easily with an ally rating to compliment the CR that tells you the level of the creature as an ally. But from what we've seen a lot of these effects are unchanged from 5e, so I'm really expecting these changes to fail. I know people like that the work this way, but that doesn't mean it's possible to balance. If Animate Objects and Polymorph are unchanged I'm going to have to replace the naugahyde on the arms of this chair, because I just have a gut feeling they completely overlooked one or the other. Fourth is mostly the DMing aspects. And I don't mean what everyone seems to endlessly complain about, which is to say, NOT the encounter system or monsters. I think the encounter system isn't really that bad. The presentation [I]sucks[/I] and it needs to explain that YES you're fully supposed to use CR 19s against a 13th level party instead of relying on people to do the math, but it works well enough. I think the monster problem can be solved pretty easily with third party content if nothing else. No, the big DMG problem is, "How do I, as a DM, run a campaign that gets the PCs to want to solve their problems by going on adventures and quests that THEY invent the goals for." I think the DMG instructs you how on to run a game, but it doesn't [B]teach you how to be a DM[/B]. I think the 1e DMG for all it's extensive and manifold flaws is a better work in this respect. It's even more frustrating because many of the things they [I]are [/I]fixing in 5e.24 -- like Paladin smite spam -- were clearly known issues by 2016 and they could have issued recommendations then. Like they're totally self-contained issues, and then they spent the two years they had on [I]thoroughly not addressing systemic problems[/I]. Like they're trying to fix martial-caster disparity with weapon mastery, and (a) no, it doesn't, and (b) it's slowing the game down even more. Words cannot express how much I don't want to roll a saving throw vs topple again, while other masteries like nick should [I]just be how the game works[/I]. [/QUOTE]
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