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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Asisreo" data-source="post: 8006848" data-attributes="member: 7019027">I feel like these discussions are much like when there's discussions on "Who's the best superhero by means of fighting each other." IME, a common argument is if they knew who they were fighting, batman would be superior since he always has a plan to take out anyone. But I don't necessarily think that's either fair namely because only Batman gets to define the terms, set up the environment, understands weaknesses, and have near unlimited resources to do his plans. The scenario leans heavily into batman's strength while hardly giving the other heroes a chance to play into theirs. Likewise, these questions always, and I mean always, lean into the Wizard's strength only because they get the chance to prepare and it's an honorable duel where surprises aren't allowed. Because it becomes less Wizard-sided when the Wizard can't prepare. The Rogue could easily sneak up on the wizard and potentially instakill him, especially if the Rogue is an assassin. If the battle starts in melee, a Barbarian gets to be extremely more effective than if the Barbarian is allowed to Kite them. If the Druid doesn't start the battle Wildshaped, an enemy could take them down in the first round. Actually, a sleep spell is able to keep a Druid from Wildshaping. If you cast it around level 3, which is admittedly high for a sleep spell but it forces no saves, they'll have 9d8 hp to force the sleep which is 40hp average. Now, sleep shouldn't be your first spell but it's a nice finisher when the wildshape form has already taken a beating. I don't believe wildshaping back ends any condition that you have, so the Druid would still be asleep. That's when you cast your highest level spell or use your deadliest attack. They'll autofail any str/dex save and attacks have advantage with crits on attacks within 5ft. Druids without the wildshape tend to be squishy. At least, too squishy to handle that. Even if they survive, the strategy is still in effect.</blockquote>

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