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<blockquote data-quote="Crimson Longinus" data-source="post: 9331446" data-attributes="member: 7025508">So whilst I don't think usually downscaling the outcomes from those what the players expected is needed there are some situation in which it is. And I don't know a single game where this is not the case. And in situation where the exact thing the players want to achieve is impossible in one go, if possible, it is good idea to give them progress towards it. Are you genuinely arguing that this is not commonly the case in almost every RPG? That the players can just ask literally anything and the GM must allow them to roll for it? Because I just don't think this is the case. In earlier Ironsworn (IIRC) example we saw this was not the case. It is not the case in Blades, I doubt it is the case in Burning Wheel either, but please don't make me find the PDF. And simply from narrative sense being able to get anything with one roll is obviously undesirable. If this tyrant is the main enemy, overthrowing of which the players are invested in, then just marching to them and telling them to abdicate, and they do, would not be a very good story. Gimli just shattering the One Ring with his axe because he mistakenly though that he could would not be a good story. And if the dramatic angle of your character is that their brother is missing, then just finding the brother drinking in a nearby tavern via a circle check would not be a good story. You're again erected this sort of absolutist dogmatic objection that doesn't actually correspond to the reality. The thing you protest exist in practically every game in one form or another.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Crimson Longinus, post: 9331446, member: 7025508"] So whilst I don't think usually downscaling the outcomes from those what the players expected is needed there are some situation in which it is. And I don't know a single game where this is not the case. And in situation where the exact thing the players want to achieve is impossible in one go, if possible, it is good idea to give them progress towards it. Are you genuinely arguing that this is not commonly the case in almost every RPG? That the players can just ask literally anything and the GM must allow them to roll for it? Because I just don't think this is the case. In earlier Ironsworn (IIRC) example we saw this was not the case. It is not the case in Blades, I doubt it is the case in Burning Wheel either, but please don't make me find the PDF. And simply from narrative sense being able to get anything with one roll is obviously undesirable. If this tyrant is the main enemy, overthrowing of which the players are invested in, then just marching to them and telling them to abdicate, and they do, would not be a very good story. Gimli just shattering the One Ring with his axe because he mistakenly though that he could would not be a good story. And if the dramatic angle of your character is that their brother is missing, then just finding the brother drinking in a nearby tavern via a circle check would not be a good story. You're again erected this sort of absolutist dogmatic objection that doesn't actually correspond to the reality. The thing you protest exist in practically every game in one form or another. [/QUOTE]

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