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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Xeviat" data-source="post: 7188894" data-attributes="member: 57494">These are some interesting thoughts, and some are venturing into areas other than out of combat. But, there are some room for ribbons there.First, at 3rd level, the Battle Master gets a (weak) ribbon in a tool proficiency. Other UA fighter Archetypes get some extra skills and such here. This would be useful. Rather than necessarily getting Expertise, for instance, maybe they could get proficiency modifier to certain skills whether or not they had it already (so the Noble Cavalier may stack on persuasion and history, but the Folk Hero Cavalier would learn some new skills). There's certainly room there for a little extra.As for the Fighter getting some unique things, noncombat or not, I keep going back to Weapon Mastery, High Mastery, and Grand Mastery. Fighters knew how to use weapons better than others. Yes, Extra Attack 2 and 3 do this, but what if they got "Improved Fighting Style" and more at certain places. Things like removing the bonus action requirement from TWFing and other things could go in here as uniquely Fighter things (but that's slightly off topic) without getting too strange.I'm not sure the Fighter really needs an actual buff at 2nd sand 5th compared to the other warriors, but getting some lesser, ribbon abilities would be fine. Let's look at the Fighter vs the Paladin.1stFighter: Fighting Style, Second WindPaladin: Divine Sense, Lay on HandsComparison: Lay on Hands and Second Wind are comparable. Second Wind offers way more daily healing (19.5 vs 5), but it doesn't work on others. Divine Sense is a Ribbon, Fighting Style is offensive power. The Fighter could use a Ribbon here, and Fighting Style could be dropped to 1st for the Paladin.2ndFighter: Action SurgePaladin: Fighting Style, Spellcasting, Divine SmiteComparison: Fighting Style on the paladin only balances out 1st level. If you pretend smite is just a spell and it's the only spell the paladin has, spellcasting and action surge balance out. Spellcasting can be used for utility things, but action surge can be used in exploration too, so the extended benefits could balance out. 2 smites equal +18 damage per day; 3 extra attacks from action surge is +19.2 damage on longsword with duelist or +23.3 on greatsword with GWFing.3rdFighter: ArchetypePaladin: Divine Health, Oath (oath spells and 2 channel divinity options 1/short rest), +1 1st level spell.Comparison: Here, we see room for an expansion of ability. The Archetype ability should be as good as channel divinity, so the Fighter should really get something along the power level of Divine Health. Adding something more to the Archetypes would be great here. The extra paladin spell slot brings us to 3/day vs 1/short action surge, which sounds fair even though it's +27 damage vs +23.3; close enough. 4thComparison: both get ASI.5th (ugh)Fighter: Extra AttackPaladin: Extra Attack, 2nd level spells (2/day)Comparison: On the surface, this seems bad for the Fighter. The paladin does get extra utility options. If they use their new spell slots (1 1st and 2 2nds) entirely for smiting, though, it's an increase of +36 damage. Since Extra Attack and Action Surge stack, this is also a +19-23 damage increase for the Fighter. That's behind the paladin by quite a bit, so they could probably use a little something more there.I'm finding myself thinking of changing the subclasses, expanding Fighting Style, and altering Action Surge as a way of giving the Fighter something more unique. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk</blockquote>

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