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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
What should 4e steal from 13th Age?
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<blockquote data-quote="hvg3akaek" data-source="post: 6261006" data-attributes="member: 71190"><p>Our group is a bunch of engineers, so we weren't ready to let go of our tactical maps - maybe one 'generalised' battle every session or so, but we al feel more comfortable, and have more fun, with grids.</p><p></p><p>There were also mixed feelings on backgrounds instead of skills, and so although some really liked 13A's take, we stuck with 4e.</p><p></p><p>However, what we have taken includes:</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Escalation Die (and had the bonus not stack with expertise, so those feats are no longer a feat tax)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Ten-level structure (I set it up so that each new level = three 4e levels, and you get a bonus one at a tier jump. Thus level 1 = 4e level 1; level 5 = 4e level 14; and level 10 = 4e level 30).</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Only 1 feat per level (again, removing feat tax, making feat more interesting)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Incremental Advancements (after each session, choose one element of your next level to gain)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Pass a save to SW a second time</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Can go negative with surges (with the penalty to rolls if you do so)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Death Saves from 13A (change the numbers and results - makes for more bounceback, less downtime)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Double and Triple main stat damage at paragon and epic</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Level to miss damage (and added to any miss damage that already exists)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Can take ability modifiers from class and race (so, main one of race, and main one of class; a little flexibility allowed, too).</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">"Fleeing" option spelled out at the start (run away from dangerous encounters!)</li> </ul><p></p><p>I also worked at cutting back powers by giving them "bonus points" for each power dropped, to add bonuses to other powers as they saw fit. 1 bonus a tier, and you had to give every power a bonus before giving any a second. Most bonuses are just an extra die of damage, but some were more interesting (making a power target ref or will instead of just one of them; slow + prone instead of just one, etc).</p><p></p><p>We're still getting the feel of it, but so far, things are working - one player dropped half his powers and managed to give his twin strike +2[W] damage - impressive, but not game breaking (because everyone is doing it). And when the whole group is doing similar things, it also allows them to get through encounters more quickly.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="hvg3akaek, post: 6261006, member: 71190"] Our group is a bunch of engineers, so we weren't ready to let go of our tactical maps - maybe one 'generalised' battle every session or so, but we al feel more comfortable, and have more fun, with grids. There were also mixed feelings on backgrounds instead of skills, and so although some really liked 13A's take, we stuck with 4e. However, what we have taken includes: [LIST] [*]Escalation Die (and had the bonus not stack with expertise, so those feats are no longer a feat tax) [*]Ten-level structure (I set it up so that each new level = three 4e levels, and you get a bonus one at a tier jump. Thus level 1 = 4e level 1; level 5 = 4e level 14; and level 10 = 4e level 30). [*]Only 1 feat per level (again, removing feat tax, making feat more interesting) [*]Incremental Advancements (after each session, choose one element of your next level to gain) [*]Pass a save to SW a second time [*]Can go negative with surges (with the penalty to rolls if you do so) [*]Death Saves from 13A (change the numbers and results - makes for more bounceback, less downtime) [*]Double and Triple main stat damage at paragon and epic [*]Level to miss damage (and added to any miss damage that already exists) [*]Can take ability modifiers from class and race (so, main one of race, and main one of class; a little flexibility allowed, too). [*]"Fleeing" option spelled out at the start (run away from dangerous encounters!) [/LIST] I also worked at cutting back powers by giving them "bonus points" for each power dropped, to add bonuses to other powers as they saw fit. 1 bonus a tier, and you had to give every power a bonus before giving any a second. Most bonuses are just an extra die of damage, but some were more interesting (making a power target ref or will instead of just one of them; slow + prone instead of just one, etc). We're still getting the feel of it, but so far, things are working - one player dropped half his powers and managed to give his twin strike +2[W] damage - impressive, but not game breaking (because everyone is doing it). And when the whole group is doing similar things, it also allows them to get through encounters more quickly. [/QUOTE]
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