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<blockquote data-quote="HammerMan" data-source="post: 8461702" data-attributes="member: 84112">yes and no3e worked off what someone some where termed the Christmas tree effect.wizards will have magic items too, there were Int boosting items, pearls of power to recall spells, wands and staves to hold off hand spells and scrolls for bigger one use ones...my favorite spell caster i ever saw was at a store game that I wasn't even in, and they had some huge DC like DC22 for first level spells or something. If he targeted a low save it was almost an auto fail save.I responded to talk about the issue...and again the complaint seems to have gone over your head... saves (pre 3e) were not meant to bypass hp regularly...a save is &quot;saving from disaster&quot; and as you get higher in level you are suposed to have 2 layers of defense (Well 3 if you count AC/HP as two). Your Ac went down, your HP went up and you got BETTER at all the saves. 3e changed this... by giving the DC to the caster to modified at all times (I am trying to remember I think there were penelties on rare occasions, but remembering raw to house rule is very hard form 22 years ago).3e made it so save or suck or save or die spells could land MORE OFTEN THEN NOT even at high levels.why is that a problem?yes becuse the main character should not die more often then not to 1 roll... until 3emonsters shouldn't die in 1 roll either...</blockquote>

[QUOTE="HammerMan, post: 8461702, member: 84112"] yes and no 3e worked off what someone some where termed the Christmas tree effect. wizards will have magic items too, there were Int boosting items, pearls of power to recall spells, wands and staves to hold off hand spells and scrolls for bigger one use ones... my favorite spell caster i ever saw was at a store game that I wasn't even in, and they had some huge DC like DC22 for first level spells or something. If he targeted a low save it was almost an auto fail save. I responded to talk about the issue... and again the complaint seems to have gone over your head... saves (pre 3e) were not meant to bypass hp regularly... a save is "saving from disaster" and as you get higher in level you are suposed to have 2 layers of defense (Well 3 if you count AC/HP as two). Your Ac went down, your HP went up and you got BETTER at all the saves. 3e changed this... by giving the DC to the caster to modified at all times (I am trying to remember I think there were penelties on rare occasions, but remembering raw to house rule is very hard form 22 years ago). 3e made it so save or suck or save or die spells could land MORE OFTEN THEN NOT even at high levels. why is that a problem? yes becuse the main character should not die more often then not to 1 roll... until 3e monsters shouldn't die in 1 roll either... [/QUOTE]

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