NOW LIVE! Today's the day you meet your new best friend. You don’t have to leave Wolfy behind... In 'Pets & Sidekicks' your companions level up with you!

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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Twowolves" data-source="post: 4123058" data-attributes="member: 18093">I haven't read the entire thread, so please forgive me if these points are addressed elsewhere.ALL of these were like this in 1st ed, so it's not something wrong with *just* 2nd ed. Five kinds, and they were the same as 1st ed again. They are the same 5 categories, but each class is better at one type than others, and they level progression is different. But again, not every class is different, every type of class is (fighters, rangers and paladins all have the same chart, rogues and bards share a chart, etc).There were hand to hand unarmed rules in 2nd ed, right in the PHB. They were silly and ignorant, but they were in the core books. And they were expanded upon in the Complete Fighter book, and greatly expanded upon in the Complete Ninja handbook. There were also monks in the Complete Priest's book, the Complete Ninja's book, and a full 1-20 level base class in the Scarlett Brotherhood book for Greyhawk.Again, all of which were the same in 1st ed. I ran a regular campaign for years and the highest level PC was 9th. And we never complained about it, really. Gaining a level was a big event, and you had lots of time to get the hang of what you could do before having to rewrite your sheet the next time you level up. The not getting more hit dice (note: you still got hit POINTS, just not dice) past name level wasn't so bad when you consider that by the time you have over 50hp, the nature of the game shifts away from the importance of hp. Instead of piling up huge numbers of hp for both PCs and NPCs/monsters, (for which clerical healing couldn't ever keep up anyway, barring Heal spells), most fights became sort of paper/rock/scissors, where you beat monsters not by doing damage to them, but by destroying them outright (Disintegrate didn't do damage, it just, well, disintegrated you), removing them from the fight (Maze, Imprisonment, Otto's Irresistable Dance), or otherwise neutralizing them (Hold Monster, Charm Monster, Otiluke's Resiliant Sphere). Rare were the high level spells that just dealt damage outright.And any 2nd level wizard can be killed rather easily by a fighter with a Ring of Spell Storing that contains an Anti-Magic Shell, so it wasn't quite the wizard lovefest some make it out to be.I agree that 2nd edition had some problems, most of which were grandfathered in from 1st ed. The roll high/roll low/roll % thing was a problem. The front end-loaded nature of kits was a problem. The splatbook powercreep was a problem (Complete Book of Elves, anyone?). The completely crappy adventures were a huge problem (dungeons weren't "cool" anymore, whole adventures with little or no maps but lots of boxed text were, apparantly). 3rd ed was a huge leap forward, but there is still a market for 1st/2nd style gaming, as to the popularity of Castles and Crusades will attest.</blockquote>

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