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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Captain Trek" data-source="post: 5880211" data-attributes="member: 6689841">Especially as we've decided that the Swordsage's final "Pathfinder bonus" (note that fixing tumbling has officially become a seperate issue to that for us now) consists of removing the 3/day limit on its capstone ability and granting it Bonus Feats at 6th level and every 5 levels thereafter (similar to the Bonus Feat progression of the Magus), having to take Skill Focus (Acrobatics) to be an especially effective tumbler doesn't seem any worse to me than trippers having to take Improved and Greater Trip or what-have-you... As for Tumble Defense, keep in mind that often HD =/= BAB =/= CR. Stone Giants, for example, are 12 HD, +9 BAB and CR 8. Their TD would be 21 (9 BAB, 15 Dex), giving me a 70% chance of success at 8th level even without the Boots (which I plan to have long-since acquired by that stage), or 95% with them. And that's if I stick with my current plan of taking the Skill Focus at 11th level (I could take it sooner). Indeed, going through the CR 5-10 monsters, my having an approx. 75% of making my tumble without the Boots or a virtual automatic pass with them seems about the norm, and at higher levels this ratio seems to remain similar provided I take that Skill Focus... To me, that seems in line with the sense of tumbling remaning challenging that my GM wants to engender without breaking its usefulness against the average monster. This also gives the DM the ability to tailor something to counter my tumbling ability by using high-Dex enemies (or to tailor something to cater to it by using low-Dex ones, obviously).</blockquote>

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