Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
What's a Freelance RPG Writer Worth?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Steve Conan Trustrum" data-source="post: 7659061" data-attributes="member: 1620"><p>Incorrect.</p><p></p><p>Making a sale and getting money back is not "profit." "Profit" is the point where incoming money surpasses outbound. As I said, the idea that "just about anybody with a pulse can do that" is a false one. Sure, just about anyone who can put a product together can SELL a few copies of it, at least (but not always), but it doesn't mean they'll make a PROFIT doing so. And when I talk about "outbound" expenses, I'm talking about spending time actually doing the work instead of, for example, spending that time doing freelance writing for any number of FAR more lucrative industries.</p><p></p><p>The fact that many people, yourself included, don't differentiate between profit and being able to make a sale is part of the misconceptions I initially referred to. </p><p></p><p>And yet soooooooooooooooo many people who think as you do put out absolutely horrible product that never reaches a state of profitability.</p><p></p><p>Not necessarily.</p><p></p><p>Let's say you're a guy who makes lots of homebrew stuff for his games, and all your friends say "why don't you try selling it!" So, you pitch some ideas around, apply to some freelance job ads, but nothing ever really seems to take off for you at a rate of return you feel is fair. So, "screw it! How hard can it be?" you say to yourself, and you jump right in using desktop publishing. After all, you've got great ideas and a pulse! Surely you can do better on your own, right?</p><p></p><p>Well, as it turns out ...</p><p></p><p>... it takes more to putting together an appealing, useful product than knowing how to use Word, buy stock art, and figure out the technical functions of a layout program. Stuff like branding, marketing, and aesthetics matter. So does an actual ability to write for your market. As another kick in the head, publishing actually involves a bunch of legal mumbo-jumbo that fits into a realm of law that is also one of the most misunderstood. Great ideas and knowing how to satisfy a free online community that downloads your creations from your personal website is not quite the same as knowing how to put something together, beyond the technical aspects, that people will pay for. (Even being a successful and experienced freelance writer is a far cry from this.)</p><p></p><p>So, you jump in with both feet and put out product that has all sorts of issues that you didn't account for because you've no experience writing for a publisher, let alone BEING that publisher. After all, as a freelancer you just write what and how you are told -- if you're lucky, you've got a style guide to work with that may shed some light on the particulars. And since you only get one chance to make a first impression, and you've done so to a market you've not already established a foothold in, you've just stuck both feet into something else. Something that doesn't smell so nice. If you're lucky, the potential customer base will give you a second (and likely third, fourth, and fifth) shot while you work out the bugs in your writing, production, and marketing. But perhaps they won't. What's worse is the fact that, as a freelancer, you would have been paid and moved on to something else days, weeks, or even months ago, but because you published it yourself, you've invested all this extra time (and thus cost) into the product that just takes a deeper bite. The fact that this additional expense doesn't show up on an invoice or pay stub doesn't mean it's not there.</p><p></p><p>Quite simply, no. No, publishing for yourself does not necessarily mean one is likely to get a superior rate of return versus freelancing. Not even remotely.</p><p></p><p>By way of example: a freelancer who has a working relationship with an established publisher they trust with an equally established customer base who works SOLELY on fair royalty rates is likely to earn a hell of a lot more for the same product than either a freelancer working at a low pay rate or who decides to publish it themselves. Still, even the one who works for a low rate is, given the odds of success in this industry, more likely to be better off working for a lower pay rate as a freelancer than they are self-publishing from a position of inexperience.</p><p></p><p>During which time you're quite possibly not earning any profit to account for the expenses your learning process is eating up.</p><p></p><p>It is NOT cheap.</p><p></p><p>Time is money.</p><p></p><p>Learning how to successfully publish to the point of profitability is a massive time eater. That means it's a massive eater of profitability.</p><p></p><p>If you break down the hourly rate it takes me to write and publish a RPG product compared to the $100 I can make writing a single 1,000 word blog as a professional web content writer, you see how Misfit Studios eats away at my overall profitability as a writer. And that is considering Misfit Studios is a successful and profitable (and by this, I'll clarify, I mean by comparing expenses to income) small press RPG company that has been around for more than a decade and has a large, established market.</p><p></p><p>Just how many of those benefits do you think new publishers without experience or, frankly, the know-how, going in are going to enjoy? Do you think they can all afford to turn down more profitable options in other industries to wait on fulfilling their RPG industry dreams?</p><p></p><p>Honestly?</p><p></p><p>Again, another common misconception.</p><p></p><p>Some people, no matter how much time and discipline they show, will never become writers able to function at a professional level, no matter how good their ideas are or how much their gaming group enjoys their creations, let alone successful publishers. Whether they lack talent or the insight to foresee the right sort of product the market will bite onto (or any number of other things that can go wrong), it takes a LOT more to get by as a writer or publisher than just time and discipline.</p><p></p><p>Far more people try to make it as publishers than there are those who succeed, and the same goes for people who feel they have what it takes to become freelance RPG writers. (And by "far more," I feel comfortable qualifying that by adding "exponentially.") The amount of publishers who are successful enough to earn a living wage are even more rare -- they are the honest politicians of the RPG industry.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Steve Conan Trustrum, post: 7659061, member: 1620"] Incorrect. Making a sale and getting money back is not "profit." "Profit" is the point where incoming money surpasses outbound. As I said, the idea that "just about anybody with a pulse can do that" is a false one. Sure, just about anyone who can put a product together can SELL a few copies of it, at least (but not always), but it doesn't mean they'll make a PROFIT doing so. And when I talk about "outbound" expenses, I'm talking about spending time actually doing the work instead of, for example, spending that time doing freelance writing for any number of FAR more lucrative industries. The fact that many people, yourself included, don't differentiate between profit and being able to make a sale is part of the misconceptions I initially referred to. And yet soooooooooooooooo many people who think as you do put out absolutely horrible product that never reaches a state of profitability. Not necessarily. Let's say you're a guy who makes lots of homebrew stuff for his games, and all your friends say "why don't you try selling it!" So, you pitch some ideas around, apply to some freelance job ads, but nothing ever really seems to take off for you at a rate of return you feel is fair. So, "screw it! How hard can it be?" you say to yourself, and you jump right in using desktop publishing. After all, you've got great ideas and a pulse! Surely you can do better on your own, right? Well, as it turns out ... ... it takes more to putting together an appealing, useful product than knowing how to use Word, buy stock art, and figure out the technical functions of a layout program. Stuff like branding, marketing, and aesthetics matter. So does an actual ability to write for your market. As another kick in the head, publishing actually involves a bunch of legal mumbo-jumbo that fits into a realm of law that is also one of the most misunderstood. Great ideas and knowing how to satisfy a free online community that downloads your creations from your personal website is not quite the same as knowing how to put something together, beyond the technical aspects, that people will pay for. (Even being a successful and experienced freelance writer is a far cry from this.) So, you jump in with both feet and put out product that has all sorts of issues that you didn't account for because you've no experience writing for a publisher, let alone BEING that publisher. After all, as a freelancer you just write what and how you are told -- if you're lucky, you've got a style guide to work with that may shed some light on the particulars. And since you only get one chance to make a first impression, and you've done so to a market you've not already established a foothold in, you've just stuck both feet into something else. Something that doesn't smell so nice. If you're lucky, the potential customer base will give you a second (and likely third, fourth, and fifth) shot while you work out the bugs in your writing, production, and marketing. But perhaps they won't. What's worse is the fact that, as a freelancer, you would have been paid and moved on to something else days, weeks, or even months ago, but because you published it yourself, you've invested all this extra time (and thus cost) into the product that just takes a deeper bite. The fact that this additional expense doesn't show up on an invoice or pay stub doesn't mean it's not there. Quite simply, no. No, publishing for yourself does not necessarily mean one is likely to get a superior rate of return versus freelancing. Not even remotely. By way of example: a freelancer who has a working relationship with an established publisher they trust with an equally established customer base who works SOLELY on fair royalty rates is likely to earn a hell of a lot more for the same product than either a freelancer working at a low pay rate or who decides to publish it themselves. Still, even the one who works for a low rate is, given the odds of success in this industry, more likely to be better off working for a lower pay rate as a freelancer than they are self-publishing from a position of inexperience. During which time you're quite possibly not earning any profit to account for the expenses your learning process is eating up. It is NOT cheap. Time is money. Learning how to successfully publish to the point of profitability is a massive time eater. That means it's a massive eater of profitability. If you break down the hourly rate it takes me to write and publish a RPG product compared to the $100 I can make writing a single 1,000 word blog as a professional web content writer, you see how Misfit Studios eats away at my overall profitability as a writer. And that is considering Misfit Studios is a successful and profitable (and by this, I'll clarify, I mean by comparing expenses to income) small press RPG company that has been around for more than a decade and has a large, established market. Just how many of those benefits do you think new publishers without experience or, frankly, the know-how, going in are going to enjoy? Do you think they can all afford to turn down more profitable options in other industries to wait on fulfilling their RPG industry dreams? Honestly? Again, another common misconception. Some people, no matter how much time and discipline they show, will never become writers able to function at a professional level, no matter how good their ideas are or how much their gaming group enjoys their creations, let alone successful publishers. Whether they lack talent or the insight to foresee the right sort of product the market will bite onto (or any number of other things that can go wrong), it takes a LOT more to get by as a writer or publisher than just time and discipline. Far more people try to make it as publishers than there are those who succeed, and the same goes for people who feel they have what it takes to become freelance RPG writers. (And by "far more," I feel comfortable qualifying that by adding "exponentially.") The amount of publishers who are successful enough to earn a living wage are even more rare -- they are the honest politicians of the RPG industry. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
What's a Freelance RPG Writer Worth?
Top