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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
What's so bad about 4th edition? What's so good about other systems?
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<blockquote data-quote="Argyle King" data-source="post: 5618728" data-attributes="member: 58416"><p>I agree that it would portray combat as being deadly. However, I view that as a plus as well as a reason to further support non-combat options. I'd prefer that 'let's just hack through it' not always be the best answer. Sometimes diplomacy and other options might actually be the smarter choice. Perhaps combat *is* the right choice, but you need to use a knowledge skill to uncover an edge or a secret weakness you can use.</p><p></p><p>Also, I find it somewhat more heroic (especially if I'm going for a gritty game) to succeed in the face of adversity. Conan often does get wounded; in many cases, severely wounded. In one of the stories, without the intervention of a deity, he would have been killed by something as simple as poison.</p><p></p><p>I will agree that Conan is unrealistic. However, part of my point is that (IMO) 4th Edition is build around ideas which are even more unrealistic. It's also important to point out that while Conan himself is larger than life and gets a boost from being the BA protagonist of the stories, the same can't be said for the other characters nor the world he lives in. </p><p></p><p>Despite the unrealistic nature of some fiction, it's not unheard of for people here in our own real world to beat the odds. The easiest example I can think of would be Audie Murphy. He was told he would never make it as a combat soldier; that he wasn't built for it. To bring up only one example when he beat the odds, he single handedly wiped out a machine gun crew, and then proceeded to use the machine gun of the crew he had killed to hunt down and destroy other elements of the enemy.</p><p></p><p>For me, I suppose it comes down to why I prefer Captain America over Superman. Both are very similar heroes. However, Cap -to me- is the better hero (in the moral sense of the word) because of his ability to succeed in the face of adversity. Likewise, he still chooses to do what he feels is the right thing with the knowledge that he can get hurt and/or killed just like anyone else would.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Argyle King, post: 5618728, member: 58416"] I agree that it would portray combat as being deadly. However, I view that as a plus as well as a reason to further support non-combat options. I'd prefer that 'let's just hack through it' not always be the best answer. Sometimes diplomacy and other options might actually be the smarter choice. Perhaps combat *is* the right choice, but you need to use a knowledge skill to uncover an edge or a secret weakness you can use. Also, I find it somewhat more heroic (especially if I'm going for a gritty game) to succeed in the face of adversity. Conan often does get wounded; in many cases, severely wounded. In one of the stories, without the intervention of a deity, he would have been killed by something as simple as poison. I will agree that Conan is unrealistic. However, part of my point is that (IMO) 4th Edition is build around ideas which are even more unrealistic. It's also important to point out that while Conan himself is larger than life and gets a boost from being the BA protagonist of the stories, the same can't be said for the other characters nor the world he lives in. Despite the unrealistic nature of some fiction, it's not unheard of for people here in our own real world to beat the odds. The easiest example I can think of would be Audie Murphy. He was told he would never make it as a combat soldier; that he wasn't built for it. To bring up only one example when he beat the odds, he single handedly wiped out a machine gun crew, and then proceeded to use the machine gun of the crew he had killed to hunt down and destroy other elements of the enemy. For me, I suppose it comes down to why I prefer Captain America over Superman. Both are very similar heroes. However, Cap -to me- is the better hero (in the moral sense of the word) because of his ability to succeed in the face of adversity. Likewise, he still chooses to do what he feels is the right thing with the knowledge that he can get hurt and/or killed just like anyone else would. [/QUOTE]
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What's so bad about 4th edition? What's so good about other systems?
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