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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
What's so bad about 4th edition? What's so good about other systems?
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<blockquote data-quote="catastrophic" data-source="post: 5621516" data-attributes="member: 81381"><p>The problem with that is that those resources then have to be balanced for in combat terms, and you end up making characters that much less important- it leans back towards 3e style items where you can barely see many pc builds under all those decorations.</p><p> </p><p>I would argue for noncombat and combat to be seperated, while noncombat resources would effect the stakes of combat. For instance, where is the pc fight taking place- on the frontier of your foe's empire, or in their throne room? That difference would be made up by your armies, lands, siege engines, grand magics, and so on. That's what would get you to that fight.</p><p> </p><p>But the fight itself can't be decided by how many GP you pile into your consumable buff poitions or w/e, because then combat would be dominated by such effects- and frankly it's not possible to balance say, gold that get's you alchemists fire, against gold that you spend on 100 pikemen.</p><p> </p><p>Keeping them seperate ensures that both systems can be well balanced and as a result, fun and compelling, instead of just being about key mega-builds within an endless field of traps, which is the problem with 3e.</p><p> </p><p>An option i've suggested before is to have coinage as the heroic tier resource, and allow it to be used to purchase mundane equipment and minor magics. </p><p> </p><p>Then in paragon, have Boons and Hoards, in other words land, title, huge piles of gold, retainers, and other things that aren't going to make you better at slaying dragons, but are certainly vital for winning wars, and changing the world. </p><p> </p><p>Then in epic the resource would be POWER, straight up cosmic power in various forms- worshippers, porfolios, mega-artifacts, and so on. In theory, power would help you in combat, in pratice, your ability to make war on other epic tier threats would stil be determined by you combat powers- but your Power would determine again, the stakes, and the outcomes you have the resources to create. Sure, you can beat an angry god in a fight. But to imprison them, or kill them, you'd need the kind of power that epic tier would have as a resource, not a combat option.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="catastrophic, post: 5621516, member: 81381"] The problem with that is that those resources then have to be balanced for in combat terms, and you end up making characters that much less important- it leans back towards 3e style items where you can barely see many pc builds under all those decorations. I would argue for noncombat and combat to be seperated, while noncombat resources would effect the stakes of combat. For instance, where is the pc fight taking place- on the frontier of your foe's empire, or in their throne room? That difference would be made up by your armies, lands, siege engines, grand magics, and so on. That's what would get you to that fight. But the fight itself can't be decided by how many GP you pile into your consumable buff poitions or w/e, because then combat would be dominated by such effects- and frankly it's not possible to balance say, gold that get's you alchemists fire, against gold that you spend on 100 pikemen. Keeping them seperate ensures that both systems can be well balanced and as a result, fun and compelling, instead of just being about key mega-builds within an endless field of traps, which is the problem with 3e. An option i've suggested before is to have coinage as the heroic tier resource, and allow it to be used to purchase mundane equipment and minor magics. Then in paragon, have Boons and Hoards, in other words land, title, huge piles of gold, retainers, and other things that aren't going to make you better at slaying dragons, but are certainly vital for winning wars, and changing the world. Then in epic the resource would be POWER, straight up cosmic power in various forms- worshippers, porfolios, mega-artifacts, and so on. In theory, power would help you in combat, in pratice, your ability to make war on other epic tier threats would stil be determined by you combat powers- but your Power would determine again, the stakes, and the outcomes you have the resources to create. Sure, you can beat an angry god in a fight. But to imprison them, or kill them, you'd need the kind of power that epic tier would have as a resource, not a combat option. [/QUOTE]
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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
What's so bad about 4th edition? What's so good about other systems?
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