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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 6037545" data-attributes="member: 87792">This I'll definitely agree with.  Goblins, Hobgoblins, and Bugbears are different creatures.My view is it's quite simple.  They released 4e about a year too early; they'd planned a different game (<a href="http://forum.rpg.net/showthread.php?633648-What-4e-could-have-been-a-look-at-proto-4e-info-%28also-Bo9S-was-made-up-of-4e-scraps!" target="_blank">codename Orcus</a>) that they pulled for being terrible.  Every character class recharging with a different mechanic, and no extended recharges (nothing Daily), and about a dozen separate standard condition tracks.  The salvageable ruins of this game were turned into the Book of Nine Swords because they realised it was terrible and they had to save what they could.   The time allowed for the development of 4e was the two years from June 2005 to May 2007 - but they scrapped Orcus in April 2006.  4e was basically written and rushed straight into final playtest in a year rather than two.  And it shows.And I've been talking about the difference betwen 4e (2008) and 4e (2012) for quite a while <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile    :)"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" /></blockquote>