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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 8755734" data-attributes="member: 48965">No it's really not, it's letting the fiction and narrative inform when a mechanic is purposefully nebulous and can represent numerous things.  Dying on the other hand is I assume being at 0 hit points (otherwise why differentiate it from being wounded) and at tat point you are not capable of using your sword, are unconscious and are making death saves so a far cry from being wholly uninjured and yet you're not dead either.Not-Divine as in missing the keyword which means magic originating from the gods....PHB pg 54; Divine: Divine magic comes from the gods. The gods grant power to their devotees, which clerics and paladins, for example, access through prayers and litanies. Divine magic excels at healing, protection, and smiting the enemies of the gods. Divine powers are called prayers.The Divine keyword is what signifies something is using the magic that comes from the gods.  Do any of these powers have the divine keyword?  If not I stand by what I said, call them prayers, mumbles chants, whatever... they don't use divine magic.The magic is in the rite... you just need to perform it correctly... just like using a magic item. Mundane usageDon't have any context for this so not sure what's going on.  What is the vortext, where are the PC's?Again manipulation of a magic item (runic circle). Mundane usage with the magic coming from the circleAgain... no context... this is just a skill check, what's the fiction accompanying it.Again uncertain what is happening here... is this really how so many 4e encounters were written with little to no context to the fiction.  If I had to guess I would say leaning on religious teachings to fortify one's mental fortitude to resist a psychic attack... but again not inherently supernatural.It's the holy water and/or ritual that contain the magic... can you use them correctly is what the roll is for.Might??  This is the only one where the effect seems to be coming from a mundane prayer itself and it also seems even the writers recognize this is in the realm of DM fiat.Again...context is neededmanipulation of magical terrain.Manipulation of the crystals. They are literally reversing the polarity... but they aren't generating magic themselves or creating a magical effectManipulation of devicesThis is literally using knowledge of subjects to detect a lie.This are all either specific interactions (usually with a specific rite, magic item/terrain, etc.), missing so much context that if they were written up like that I'd argue the authors didn't have a clear idea of what was going on or the one example where the word might is used... they are not allowing you to create a magical effect through the use of the skill but using the skill to determine if you already know how to use the divine magic present in something else.I'm not sure what point you are trying to make here.  It's still the skill being used to manipulate magic in an item... not you casting some type of protection spell...The description of the skills states RELIGION (INTELLIGENCE)You have picked up knowledge about gods, religious traditions and ceremonies, divine effects, holysymbols, and theology. This knowledge extends to information about the undead and the Astral Sea, including the creatures of that plane. If you have selected this skill as a trained skill, your knowledge represents academic study, either formalized or as a hobby, and you have a better chance of knowing esoteric information in this field.</blockquote>

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