Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
What's the most significant difference you've found with 4e from 3e?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Dragonblade" data-source="post: 4510872" data-attributes="member: 2804"><p>The biggest difference for me is the ease of DMing. The sheer joy of it again. Something I had not felt since 1st edition.</p><p></p><p>After trudging through the first series of Pathfinder modules it all crystalized for me. DMing 3e SUCKS. Maybe it doesn't suck for you, but for me it was torturous.</p><p></p><p>Even in a prepared module like Pathfinder I had to do a ton of prep. Every monster or NPC with a spellcasting ability had to be looked up, the spell details noted, and the ability modifier and bonus changes for buff spells all pre-calculated so that when the PCs encountered that monster or NPC, I knew all the bonuses they should have. Paizo tried doing some of the work for me, but I consistently found errors in their stat blocks. Or they would forget a spell that I thought was important. And god forbid the PCs dispelled something. What a nightmare.</p><p></p><p>Another thing that drove me nuts was them including a monster in an encounter and then instead of reprinting the stat block, they simply referenced a page number of where that monster had previously appeared. So now I had to have multiple pages marked with post-its so I could go back. Or they simply referred to stuff in the monster manual, so now I had to have multiple books opened in front of me. The adventure, the MM, and the PHB (so I could look at spells). I had to have a little side table next to me to hold everything. Such a mess.</p><p></p><p>When I DM an adventure, I should be able to run the adventure solely from the adventure itself. During play, I should NEVER have to look up a monster ability in another book. Everything I need should be self-contained in the stat block and that stat block should appear right there in the adventure in the write up for that encounter. 4e got this right. 3e was an EPIC fail.</p><p></p><p>When 4e finally came out it was like the heavens opened and angels descended. The monster stat blocks were entirely self-contained. No need to ever look anything up. The first time I ran a 4e encounter it was like a dream. I hadn't had this feeling since 1e. I felt liberated from the accounting minutiae and drudgery of 3e.</p><p></p><p>Now 4e isn't perfect. I have little quibbles here and there. For example, I think there should be a mid-combat recharge mechanic for some powers. I think some rituals should be castable in combat. But on the whole its a vast improvement.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Dragonblade, post: 4510872, member: 2804"] The biggest difference for me is the ease of DMing. The sheer joy of it again. Something I had not felt since 1st edition. After trudging through the first series of Pathfinder modules it all crystalized for me. DMing 3e SUCKS. Maybe it doesn't suck for you, but for me it was torturous. Even in a prepared module like Pathfinder I had to do a ton of prep. Every monster or NPC with a spellcasting ability had to be looked up, the spell details noted, and the ability modifier and bonus changes for buff spells all pre-calculated so that when the PCs encountered that monster or NPC, I knew all the bonuses they should have. Paizo tried doing some of the work for me, but I consistently found errors in their stat blocks. Or they would forget a spell that I thought was important. And god forbid the PCs dispelled something. What a nightmare. Another thing that drove me nuts was them including a monster in an encounter and then instead of reprinting the stat block, they simply referenced a page number of where that monster had previously appeared. So now I had to have multiple pages marked with post-its so I could go back. Or they simply referred to stuff in the monster manual, so now I had to have multiple books opened in front of me. The adventure, the MM, and the PHB (so I could look at spells). I had to have a little side table next to me to hold everything. Such a mess. When I DM an adventure, I should be able to run the adventure solely from the adventure itself. During play, I should NEVER have to look up a monster ability in another book. Everything I need should be self-contained in the stat block and that stat block should appear right there in the adventure in the write up for that encounter. 4e got this right. 3e was an EPIC fail. When 4e finally came out it was like the heavens opened and angels descended. The monster stat blocks were entirely self-contained. No need to ever look anything up. The first time I ran a 4e encounter it was like a dream. I hadn't had this feeling since 1e. I felt liberated from the accounting minutiae and drudgery of 3e. Now 4e isn't perfect. I have little quibbles here and there. For example, I think there should be a mid-combat recharge mechanic for some powers. I think some rituals should be castable in combat. But on the whole its a vast improvement. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
What's the most significant difference you've found with 4e from 3e?
Top