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What's the point of gold?
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<blockquote data-quote="Dannyalcatraz" data-source="post: 6544787" data-attributes="member: 19675"><p>I've read every Fritz Lieber story that has been commercially released.</p><p></p><p>Your question was:</p><p></p><p>In the story, Grey Mouser enters the fake Bazaar like a mouse enters a cheese-baited trap. As canny and arcane-savvy as he is, he doesn't hesitate- he goes into the store <em>expecting to be able to buy wondrous things.</em> While the situation may be rare, it is not so alien to him that he instinctively reacts with suspicion.</p><p></p><p>Now, from that point, any subsequent reader- even one turned author, game designer or GM- can then ask, "But what if the Bazaar HAD been selling legitimate magic items?" and spin a tale using that conceit. Now, we may disagree what her the examples provided are proof thereof, but I think we can agree that the list is probably not exhaustive.</p><p></p><p>Besides, it isn't as if Fritz made up the concept himself- he was, in all likelihood, inspired by the bustling real-world trade in potions, saintly relics, talismans, ancient artifacts of lost civilizations and the like that has existed since not long after humans started making them.</p><p></p><p>So I repeat, conceptual identity isn't necessary if conceptual inspiration is sufficient.</p><p></p><p>But let's go further. Elric is noted for using rare herbs and potions to maintain his energy when he is not under the influence of Stormbringer. This means he's either:</p><p></p><p>1) buying magical herbs & potions</p><p>2) buying ingredients for those and making them himself.</p><p></p><p>Or paying for underlings to acquiring 1 or 2. Regardless of which way, he's directly or indirectly spending money on magic.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>JRRT's writing style was intentionally mirroring the structure of the epic poetry- long genealogies, magic was rare, created by very few beings.</p><p></p><p>REH also intentionally constructed a world mirroring the epics of the past, with rare magic.</p><p></p><p>LeGuin's Earthsea stories focus mostly on spellcasters, not users of magic items. We have no idea what kind of magc items actually exist in the setting, if any, because they aren't important.</p><p></p><p>None of whom matter in this case anyway, since the assertion wasn't whether ALL writers post 1900 did so, the assertion was that post 1900 is when magic as technology and economic commodity first appeared in literature.</p><p></p><p></p><p><em>Nooooooope. </em>Not even: I didn't get a CPRG of any kind until 1984, the first Wizardry game.*</p><p></p><p>Yet I've personally run campaigns with magic shops of some kind or another since at least 1980 or so. And the concept didn't originate with me, either- I encountered it as a player in games run by others.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Again, you're way off the mark.</p><p></p><p>My fundamental assumption is that the standard rules of economics apply to all things.** The market may be small, or it may be large. There may be many items or few.</p><p></p><p>Regardless, I can still draw a supply and demand curve for magic items.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>* FWIW, my last one was SSI's Pool of Radiance @1992 or so. I simply don't play CRPGs.</p><p></p><p>** the only exceptions known to man are giffen goods, and magic items do not qualify as such.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Dannyalcatraz, post: 6544787, member: 19675"] I've read every Fritz Lieber story that has been commercially released. Your question was: In the story, Grey Mouser enters the fake Bazaar like a mouse enters a cheese-baited trap. As canny and arcane-savvy as he is, he doesn't hesitate- he goes into the store [I]expecting to be able to buy wondrous things.[/I] While the situation may be rare, it is not so alien to him that he instinctively reacts with suspicion. Now, from that point, any subsequent reader- even one turned author, game designer or GM- can then ask, "But what if the Bazaar HAD been selling legitimate magic items?" and spin a tale using that conceit. Now, we may disagree what her the examples provided are proof thereof, but I think we can agree that the list is probably not exhaustive. Besides, it isn't as if Fritz made up the concept himself- he was, in all likelihood, inspired by the bustling real-world trade in potions, saintly relics, talismans, ancient artifacts of lost civilizations and the like that has existed since not long after humans started making them. So I repeat, conceptual identity isn't necessary if conceptual inspiration is sufficient. But let's go further. Elric is noted for using rare herbs and potions to maintain his energy when he is not under the influence of Stormbringer. This means he's either: 1) buying magical herbs & potions 2) buying ingredients for those and making them himself. Or paying for underlings to acquiring 1 or 2. Regardless of which way, he's directly or indirectly spending money on magic. JRRT's writing style was intentionally mirroring the structure of the epic poetry- long genealogies, magic was rare, created by very few beings. REH also intentionally constructed a world mirroring the epics of the past, with rare magic. LeGuin's Earthsea stories focus mostly on spellcasters, not users of magic items. We have no idea what kind of magc items actually exist in the setting, if any, because they aren't important. None of whom matter in this case anyway, since the assertion wasn't whether ALL writers post 1900 did so, the assertion was that post 1900 is when magic as technology and economic commodity first appeared in literature. [I]Nooooooope. [/I]Not even: I didn't get a CPRG of any kind until 1984, the first Wizardry game.* Yet I've personally run campaigns with magic shops of some kind or another since at least 1980 or so. And the concept didn't originate with me, either- I encountered it as a player in games run by others. Again, you're way off the mark. My fundamental assumption is that the standard rules of economics apply to all things.** The market may be small, or it may be large. There may be many items or few. Regardless, I can still draw a supply and demand curve for magic items. * FWIW, my last one was SSI's Pool of Radiance @1992 or so. I simply don't play CRPGs. ** the only exceptions known to man are giffen goods, and magic items do not qualify as such. [/QUOTE]
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