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<blockquote data-quote="Li Shenron" data-source="post: 5842023" data-attributes="member: 1465">In the hands of the players, a save-or-die spell will easily be cast on the first round against the BBEG (and with as many buffs on the caster as possible to maximize the chance of success), spoiling an otherwise potentially challenging and memorable encounter.The DM is always free to use it more sparingly, such as for instance not casting it on the first round but let the BBEG save it for when he's losing the fight. Still, it does deliver a sense of not really being in control of your PC's destiny, if one damned roll is all that separates you from death.But I agree that at least some save-or-die effects must be in the game... one thing to notice tho, is that most iconic monsters attacks with save-or-die effect might not really be save-or-die after all! Petrification is not death, there are ways to revert the effect that are not resurrection.Also, if coup-de-grace offends you, it would be enough to just rule out that it cannot be used during a fight. The reason why coup-de-grace was put in the game was for assassinations and executions, so that being a 100hp character does not save you from a stab in the heart while sleeping or a throat slash while completely bound.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Li Shenron, post: 5842023, member: 1465"] In the hands of the players, a save-or-die spell will easily be cast on the first round against the BBEG (and with as many buffs on the caster as possible to maximize the chance of success), spoiling an otherwise potentially challenging and memorable encounter. The DM is always free to use it more sparingly, such as for instance not casting it on the first round but let the BBEG save it for when he's losing the fight. Still, it does deliver a sense of not really being in control of your PC's destiny, if one damned roll is all that separates you from death. But I agree that at least some save-or-die effects must be in the game... one thing to notice tho, is that most iconic monsters attacks with save-or-die effect might not really be save-or-[I]die [/I]after all! [B]Petrification[/B] is not death, there are ways to revert the effect that are not resurrection. Also, if coup-de-grace offends you, it would be enough to just rule out that it cannot be used [I]during[/I] a fight. The reason why coup-de-grace was put in the game was for assassinations and executions, so that being a 100hp character does not save you from a stab in the heart while sleeping or a throat slash while completely bound. [/QUOTE]

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