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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 6284857" data-attributes="member: 42582">The assumption (I think) is that this will be determined on an ad hoc basis from challenge to challnge. For instance, sometimes each failure causes damage/HS loss. But not always. In a social situation it is likely that each success will bring forth something of signficicance (eg information, or an offer or a threat). These changes in the fiction are what they are regardless of whether the challenge is a success.In practice I find this can produce something like the compromise results of a BW Duel of Wits.In the original model, a complexity 1 (4/2) required at least 4 and up to 5 rolls - disregarding secondary checks, of which there probably won't be many in such a challenge. A complexity 5 (12/6) required at least 12 and up to 17 - disregarding secondary checks, of which there are likely to be more in such a challenge. That's more than a tripling of the expected screen time, which is not nothing.In the new numbers, its 4/3 to 12/3, whch is 4 to 6 compared to 12 to 14, plus secondaries. That's more than a doubling, and in my experience noticeably more because the higher complexity brings in other features too, like more complex/subtle stakes, more advantages to be considered, more complex situation to be interpreted and responded too, etc.I didn't say it was. Though the DMG does have this to say (p 74):It’s also a good idea to think about other options the characters might exercise and how these might influence the course of the challenge. Characters might have access to utility powers or rituals that can help them. These might allow special uses of skills, perhaps with a bonus. Rituals in particular might grant an automatic success or remove failures from the running total.But the absence of a very clear mechanic for removing failures doesn't mean that the DMG + PHB advice fails to set out a workable framework. I ran my first skill challenge in my 3rd session of GMing 4e, which would have been in Feb 2009. That's before DMG 2 came out. (For anyone who's interested: the flight from the forest to the homestead in the early part of the module Night's Dark Terror. It worked well. And I didn't have any trouble incorporating being cut off by goblin wolf-riders as a consequence for failure on a check.)</blockquote>

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