Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ovinomancer" data-source="post: 7531480" data-attributes="member: 16814">No, and that's been my point.  You're caught up on "big delta must mean best" but it just means big delta.  It's like saying that you've saved more money because you bought a $100 item for 50% off than if you didn't buy it at all.  The biggest delta there is the 50% off versus none off, but you didn't save any money at all in the first case, and $100 in the second.  The biggest effect is the second one.Why would you imply what you feel?  Why not just say it?  Sorry, weird pet peeve quirk.  Carry on.Again, I think you misunderstand the question?  The question was not about you, but about which target you'd rather attack -- @11 with disadvantage or @20 with disadvantage.  You answered this question the first time (I thought) but now it seems you're trying to answer a different question?  Given @11 with or without disadvantage is an easier target than @20 without (much less with), I'm pointing out that @11 with disadvantage cannot be that large of a benefit because it's the obviously better choice of whom to attack.To further this question, would you rather attack a foe where you need an 11 with disadvantage or a 12 with disadvantage?  Why?  I think that the answer here will be pointing in the direction I'm going. (To answer my own hypothetical, it should be obvious that attacking the 11 is preferable to the 12 because of the higher hit chance.)Sigh.  My wife feels the same way.  She says she's saved me money because she bought whatever on sale.  I point out that you've saved nothing because you actually spent money.  The same applies here.  If I take 10 damage, I've spent 10 hitpoints.  If I take no damage, I don't save 10 hitpoints, I've saved all of my hitpoints because I haven't spent any at all -- I still have every one of them.  Similarly, if I spend all of my hitpoints, I haven't saved any (obviously).  If I spend half of them, I also haven't saved any -- I've spent half of them.Sure.  Now go 40 rounds.  Which is better now?  60 rounds.  100 rounds.  There's only one choice that has the possibility to last 100 rounds, and it's not 11.How many resources do you use to correct the 50 hitpoints spent vs the none spent?  You spend far more resources to keep an 11 up than a 20 -- the overall cost is much, much higher.  But you still say it's better despite admitting that you're down half your hitpoints and have to spend healing potions vs not having to do that at all because you got a bigger discount at the damage shop?  Weird.Wait, what?  I'm confused. Are you trying to propose a situation where 2 creatures are attacking you simultaneously where one needs an 11 to hit you and the other needs a 20?  And you're saying that since the 20 will rarely hit you anyway, the biggest reduction in incoming damage is to disadvantage the 11?  Sure, totally agree. This is that tactical thing that I was talking about where a specific situation leads to a choice that makes sense within that situation.  This isn't an underlying feature of the biggest effect of disadvantage, though, it's the specific tactical situation you're proposing -- 2 opponents, one inept and one fearsome.  This also touches on the other point I was making about situational choices -- you cannot choose the 11 or the 20 only.  If you could, you'd clearly choose the 20 by itself.  So, in that sense, the biggest effect is still at 20 as it reduces your total incoming damage to nearly zero -- no resources used on your part.  But, since you cannot choose, you have to weigh the entirety of the situation, and, indeed, in this situation you'll get the best use out of disadvantaging the fearsome opponent vs the inept one.Turn this around, though, and ask if you have two party members, one hit on an 11 and one hit on a 20, and you can pick one to stand in the door and hold off a big monster or horde from the rest of you, which will you pick?  Clearly the 20 and not the 11.  Situation matters.  But, as far as largest mathematical effect, it remains with the 20 as it reduces incoming hits by a factor of almost 200 versus a factor of 2 at 11.  End point.</blockquote>

Verification