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What's Your (Character's) Constitution Score?
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<blockquote data-quote="ECMO3" data-source="post: 8694465" data-attributes="member: 7030563"><p>For as long as your cleric has Healing Word .... which is usually long enough to win the fight in 5E.</p><p></p><p>As I said the number you roll is more imporant than the con bonus. A 5th level Wizard with an 8 con can have anywhere between 9 and 25hps, and what you roll on the hit die is going to matter more than the constitution score.</p><p></p><p>A Deadly encounter level for a 5th level character is 1100xp per character. This means 5th level characters should outnumber trolls 3 to 2. Three Wizards with 17hps and spells like Fear will beat two Trolls almost every time. Even if all 3 of the Wizards lose initiative they are still usually going to win this encounter unless they get a disaster in terms of saves, Troll attacks and damage. If you want to go the melee route a single 5th level Bladesinger running Haste/silvery barbs/shield or blur/shield is going to get hit once every 50 attacks by Trolls so that is about 1 hit in an 8 round fight with two trolls and a single hit won't often kill her at 17hps. Green Flame Blade with 2 more attacks in 8 turns will be close to taking both Trolls down, even with the other two wizards standing by doing nothing.</p><p></p><p></p><p>A Mage should be outnumbered 2:1 by the PCs at 5th level for a deadly encounter. If you have 2 wizards, you have 2 counterspells to his one. This is a tougher fight than the trolls because it is dominated with dice. If Mage wins initiative and you get a bad roll on counterspell and your wizards fail their saves it could be over for both of them in one turn, but the statistics still favor the two low-hp wizards in this fight and if one of them wins initiative it is virtually certain they will win this encounter. Consider a 17hp wizard with a 16 dex and absorb elements will survive a Mage's cone of cold over 70% of the time. So even if they both lose initiative, are inside the cone AOE and can't counterspell it there is a good chance one or even both survive. Assuming the 17hp Wizards have shield spell, that is the only first round play I see that has a chance to be successful for the Mage. If he gets one of them down with cone of cold this is a managable fight which he still might lose easily but if both the 17hp Wizards survive this first round alpha strike or if one wins initiative it is over for the Mage.</p><p></p><p>Surprise can change that sure, but the hit point difference is not going to matter a whole lot. Trolls against AC16 surprised wizards can't usually kill one in the first round (by kill I mean dead not 0). If they concentrate on only one and beat all three of them in initiative, with good rolls they can probably down one in the first round and kill that same one in the second round while he is unconscious. They can do that if he has a 14 Con though too and once any remaining wizards get in the fight it is over. A Mage that surprises and wins initiative and can catch both Wizards in a Cone of Cold AOE will probably win that fight. He needs to do all of that though to do it reliably, without both surprise and initiative and spacing they will have reactions and it will be tough for him to take them both down. He also needs to do average or better damage on the cone of cold.</p><p></p><p>I am not saying such characters can't die, but odds are against them dying unless you upscale the monsters beyond recommended, get great rolls or use alternate death rules. Even if you do those things though it will rarely be the Constitution score specifically that is the deciding factor between life and death. Constitution might be the difference between going down to 0 and not going to 0, but even that is going to be relatively rare. An enemy who takes you to zero with an 8 constitution is usually going to take you to 0 with a 10 or a 12 too and take you to zero on the next attack it makes with a 14 or 16.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="ECMO3, post: 8694465, member: 7030563"] For as long as your cleric has Healing Word .... which is usually long enough to win the fight in 5E. As I said the number you roll is more imporant than the con bonus. A 5th level Wizard with an 8 con can have anywhere between 9 and 25hps, and what you roll on the hit die is going to matter more than the constitution score. A Deadly encounter level for a 5th level character is 1100xp per character. This means 5th level characters should outnumber trolls 3 to 2. Three Wizards with 17hps and spells like Fear will beat two Trolls almost every time. Even if all 3 of the Wizards lose initiative they are still usually going to win this encounter unless they get a disaster in terms of saves, Troll attacks and damage. If you want to go the melee route a single 5th level Bladesinger running Haste/silvery barbs/shield or blur/shield is going to get hit once every 50 attacks by Trolls so that is about 1 hit in an 8 round fight with two trolls and a single hit won't often kill her at 17hps. Green Flame Blade with 2 more attacks in 8 turns will be close to taking both Trolls down, even with the other two wizards standing by doing nothing. A Mage should be outnumbered 2:1 by the PCs at 5th level for a deadly encounter. If you have 2 wizards, you have 2 counterspells to his one. This is a tougher fight than the trolls because it is dominated with dice. If Mage wins initiative and you get a bad roll on counterspell and your wizards fail their saves it could be over for both of them in one turn, but the statistics still favor the two low-hp wizards in this fight and if one of them wins initiative it is virtually certain they will win this encounter. Consider a 17hp wizard with a 16 dex and absorb elements will survive a Mage's cone of cold over 70% of the time. So even if they both lose initiative, are inside the cone AOE and can't counterspell it there is a good chance one or even both survive. Assuming the 17hp Wizards have shield spell, that is the only first round play I see that has a chance to be successful for the Mage. If he gets one of them down with cone of cold this is a managable fight which he still might lose easily but if both the 17hp Wizards survive this first round alpha strike or if one wins initiative it is over for the Mage. Surprise can change that sure, but the hit point difference is not going to matter a whole lot. Trolls against AC16 surprised wizards can't usually kill one in the first round (by kill I mean dead not 0). If they concentrate on only one and beat all three of them in initiative, with good rolls they can probably down one in the first round and kill that same one in the second round while he is unconscious. They can do that if he has a 14 Con though too and once any remaining wizards get in the fight it is over. A Mage that surprises and wins initiative and can catch both Wizards in a Cone of Cold AOE will probably win that fight. He needs to do all of that though to do it reliably, without both surprise and initiative and spacing they will have reactions and it will be tough for him to take them both down. He also needs to do average or better damage on the cone of cold. I am not saying such characters can't die, but odds are against them dying unless you upscale the monsters beyond recommended, get great rolls or use alternate death rules. Even if you do those things though it will rarely be the Constitution score specifically that is the deciding factor between life and death. Constitution might be the difference between going down to 0 and not going to 0, but even that is going to be relatively rare. An enemy who takes you to zero with an 8 constitution is usually going to take you to 0 with a 10 or a 12 too and take you to zero on the next attack it makes with a 14 or 16. [/QUOTE]
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