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General Tabletop Discussion
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When Fiends Attack: Are Balors, Pit Fiends and Ultraloths too weak?
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<blockquote data-quote="hawkeyefan" data-source="post: 7008801" data-attributes="member: 6785785"><p>You don't get much more classic than Dracula....and that does not describe him in any way. He terrorizes his opponents from the shadows and strikes only when it makes sense for him to do so. As soon as they do anything that harms hims or can keep him at bay, he flees. </p><p></p><p>I would agree with you that the stat block in the adventure does not match the play style you've chosen for Strahd. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>There's a lot going on in there....but I think not having Strahd immediately attempt to avoid the radiant damage and or sunlight is a huge mistake, and everything immediately goes back to that as the major influence in the battle. As soon as Rahadin entered and said the party was attacking and they had a sword that shed sunlight, Strahd should have been ready to run and simply allow his underlings to try and deal with the party. Perhaps move to the balcony above and assist his minions from there with spells and charming gazes. </p><p></p><p>Whatever you decided to do, having him remain to try and withstand the sunlight and full attacks from the party and spending ALL of his legendary actions on an attempt to charm a character that has strong saving throws was probably what led to his early demise. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I personally agree that creatures like Balors and the like should not be easy for any but the most powerful and high level of parties. And even then, I don't think that "easy" is what I'd want to go for. I have introduced a few such demons as threats in my campaign, and used them against lower level parties. I used them sparingly, in brief encounters designed more to scare the PCs and test how the monsters would work. Saw a couple of areas of concern, so that I can be ready to deal with those later on. </p><p></p><p>I can't help but put it back on the DM. If your group is that effective, and you want to preserve the status of these monsters, then if the DM puts them up against a low level party for a real fight to the end, then the DM has created the situation where the status can be diminished. If a party of level 8 characters start mopping the floor with a Balor, then it's on the DM to have the Balor flee, and then return later on when things are more conducive to his victory. </p><p></p><p>If you don't want to risk this happening, then simply do not use such monsters against lower level parties. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>I think when people say this, they're not talking about the INT stat. They are talking about behavior. Have the creature behave like a thinking being rather than a suicidal source of XP. </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>So without any direction on how to play Strahd, how come you decided on treating him like a brute? How did you come to that conclusion? Is that your default expectation for any monster? </p><p></p><p>Or did you look at his abilities and then draw that conclusion? </p><p></p><p>I find it really odd given how scrutinizing you are in so many ways....I would expect you to look at his stats and abilities, and perhaps more importantly, his weaknesses, and then determine a way to play him. I don't think it's a bad idea at all for them to provide some guidance on how to play Strahd...but without that guidance, I would expect an experienced DM....one who can see the flaws in the Feat system and with CR and Encounter design and so on....to look at the stat block and have a decent idea of how to run just about any monster. </p><p></p><p>Oh, and by the way....straight from the book:</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="hawkeyefan, post: 7008801, member: 6785785"] You don't get much more classic than Dracula....and that does not describe him in any way. He terrorizes his opponents from the shadows and strikes only when it makes sense for him to do so. As soon as they do anything that harms hims or can keep him at bay, he flees. I would agree with you that the stat block in the adventure does not match the play style you've chosen for Strahd. There's a lot going on in there....but I think not having Strahd immediately attempt to avoid the radiant damage and or sunlight is a huge mistake, and everything immediately goes back to that as the major influence in the battle. As soon as Rahadin entered and said the party was attacking and they had a sword that shed sunlight, Strahd should have been ready to run and simply allow his underlings to try and deal with the party. Perhaps move to the balcony above and assist his minions from there with spells and charming gazes. Whatever you decided to do, having him remain to try and withstand the sunlight and full attacks from the party and spending ALL of his legendary actions on an attempt to charm a character that has strong saving throws was probably what led to his early demise. I personally agree that creatures like Balors and the like should not be easy for any but the most powerful and high level of parties. And even then, I don't think that "easy" is what I'd want to go for. I have introduced a few such demons as threats in my campaign, and used them against lower level parties. I used them sparingly, in brief encounters designed more to scare the PCs and test how the monsters would work. Saw a couple of areas of concern, so that I can be ready to deal with those later on. I can't help but put it back on the DM. If your group is that effective, and you want to preserve the status of these monsters, then if the DM puts them up against a low level party for a real fight to the end, then the DM has created the situation where the status can be diminished. If a party of level 8 characters start mopping the floor with a Balor, then it's on the DM to have the Balor flee, and then return later on when things are more conducive to his victory. If you don't want to risk this happening, then simply do not use such monsters against lower level parties. I think when people say this, they're not talking about the INT stat. They are talking about behavior. Have the creature behave like a thinking being rather than a suicidal source of XP. So without any direction on how to play Strahd, how come you decided on treating him like a brute? How did you come to that conclusion? Is that your default expectation for any monster? Or did you look at his abilities and then draw that conclusion? I find it really odd given how scrutinizing you are in so many ways....I would expect you to look at his stats and abilities, and perhaps more importantly, his weaknesses, and then determine a way to play him. I don't think it's a bad idea at all for them to provide some guidance on how to play Strahd...but without that guidance, I would expect an experienced DM....one who can see the flaws in the Feat system and with CR and Encounter design and so on....to look at the stat block and have a decent idea of how to run just about any monster. Oh, and by the way....straight from the book: [/QUOTE]
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When Fiends Attack: Are Balors, Pit Fiends and Ultraloths too weak?
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