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<blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 3999187" data-attributes="member: 2067">Save-or-die/suck predicaments = Sudden CatastropheWandering Monsters = Hostile Environment + Slow AttritionVancian Magic = AttritionUnexpected &quot;gotcha&quot; Traps = Sudden CatastropheLikewise, some of the powers of magic in the various editions have supported this model: Resurrection, teleportation, anti-magic, powerful divinations (detect evil, etc), elves detecting secret doors, dwarves knowing the depth underground...these things are specifically oriented toward a Dungeon Survival style game, where they were specifically used as counter-tactics to the things that could happen to you while trying to survive in a dungeon. The old &quot;Eye of the Beholder&quot; game was pure dungeon survival as one of it's most elemental examples, based on 2e rules. Certainly some players enjoying that style are posting about how they're not really a fan of the choices that 4e is making that run counter to that style, so it seems that earlier editions (at least the third?) supported this play style better, at least, than 4e will.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="I'm A Banana, post: 3999187, member: 2067"] Save-or-die/suck predicaments = Sudden Catastrophe Wandering Monsters = Hostile Environment + Slow Attrition Vancian Magic = Attrition Unexpected "gotcha" Traps = Sudden Catastrophe Likewise, some of the powers of magic in the various editions have supported this model: Resurrection, teleportation, anti-magic, powerful divinations (detect evil, etc), elves detecting secret doors, dwarves knowing the depth underground...these things are specifically oriented toward a Dungeon Survival style game, where they were specifically used as counter-tactics to the things that could happen to you while trying to survive in a dungeon. The old "Eye of the Beholder" game was pure dungeon survival as one of it's most elemental examples, based on 2e rules. Certainly some players enjoying that style are posting about how they're not really a fan of the choices that 4e is making that run counter to that style, so it seems that earlier editions (at least the third?) supported this play style better, at least, than 4e will. [/QUOTE]

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