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<blockquote data-quote="clearstream" data-source="post: 7965619" data-attributes="member: 71699">Ah, I see. So I take attempt to include in its meaning &quot;act in a way that bears a relation to what you aim to achieve&quot;I see that Google defines it as &quot;make an effort to achieve or complete (something difficult)&quot; so I do not call it attempting if no effort is available to the character that could achieve or complete that difficult thing. A caster can attempt to cast invisibility but a 1st-level fighter with no magic items or spells cannot attempt to be invisible. What they can do is attempt to hide, but they will not be able to do so as if they were invisible, simply by saying that they attempt to hide as if they were invisible. I will disregard the invisible part and I will let them know that it cannot apply.OTOH this could be about whether DMs should ever say &quot;No&quot;. Some groups think not. I am not in that camp. I think a good DM says &quot;No&quot; whenever they need to. That makes it clear to players what the constraints are and moves them toward doing something constructive. I like my RPG to be as much game as role-play, and that gamefulness is crucial to my enjoyment. In a game, some things - those things that are against the rules - cannot be attempted. If they are, then that is to cheat or in the case of the spoilsport as Huizinga put it, to shatter the play world.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="clearstream, post: 7965619, member: 71699"] Ah, I see. So I take attempt to include in its meaning "[I]act in a way that bears a relation to what you aim to achieve[/I]" I see that Google defines it as "[I]make an effort to achieve or complete (something difficult)[/I]" so I do not call it attempting if no effort is available to the character that could achieve or complete that difficult thing. A caster can attempt to cast [I]invisibility[/I] but a 1st-level fighter with no magic items or spells cannot attempt to be invisible. What they can do is attempt to hide, but they will not be able to do so as if they were invisible, simply by saying that they attempt to hide as if they were invisible. I will disregard the invisible part and I will let them know that it cannot apply. OTOH this could be about whether DMs should ever say "[I]No[/I]". Some groups think not. I am not in that camp. I think a good DM says "[I]No[/I]" whenever they need to. That makes it clear to players what the constraints are and moves them toward doing something constructive. I like my RPG to be as much game as role-play, and that gamefulness is crucial to my enjoyment. In a game, some things - those things that are against the rules - cannot be attempted. If they are, then that is to cheat or in the case of the spoilsport as Huizinga put it, to shatter the play world. [/QUOTE]

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