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General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
When should players challenge the DM and when should they be quiet?
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<blockquote data-quote="the Jester" data-source="post: 1330943" data-attributes="member: 1210"><p>I've been thinking a lot about this lately, actually, because I have one player who tends to mouth off a lot. By which I don't mean he's offering legitimate challenges- I mean he's assuming that <em>he knows it all</em> and <em>he's caught me cheating.</em></p><p></p><p>Well, bull****.</p><p></p><p>Beyond the point that nobody knows it all and the dm can't cheat (unless he uses the rules differently for pcs than for npcs), in each aggravating instance he was challenging issues that were perfectly clear and he was very pissy about it.</p><p></p><p>For example, when the party found out about an issue (in 3.0) with simulacra exceeding the power of their creators, he burst out with, "There's no rules for that!"</p><p></p><p>(Rule: multiple empowerment of simulacrum. Doesn't work anymore for multiple reasons- simulacrum doesn't have numeric variables and you can't stack the same metamagic feat. But in 3.0 it worked fine.)</p><p></p><p>Another example: the pcs were fighting a dragon that they thought was a shadow dragon, but then it breathed lightning.</p><p></p><p>Pissy player: "Can you apply the half-dragon template to a dragon?"</p><p>Me: Devilish grin.</p><p>Pissy player: "That's so stupid. That's so against the rules."</p><p></p><p>(Rule: a half-dragon dragon is specifically mentioned as a way to simulate crossbreeds in Savage Species.)</p><p></p><p>So basically, don't challenge the dm if you don't understand how it works. Challenge the dm if you think he's using a double standard either for or against the pcs, or if he isn't treating all the pcs the same, or if he makes a major mistake or a ruling that invalidates a chunk of your character build. But always, <em>always</em> accept that he may make rulings that you don't agree with. And if it's a big deal talk about it after the game's over or on a break, but let it go during the game.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="the Jester, post: 1330943, member: 1210"] I've been thinking a lot about this lately, actually, because I have one player who tends to mouth off a lot. By which I don't mean he's offering legitimate challenges- I mean he's assuming that [i]he knows it all[/i] and [i]he's caught me cheating.[/i] Well, bull****. Beyond the point that nobody knows it all and the dm can't cheat (unless he uses the rules differently for pcs than for npcs), in each aggravating instance he was challenging issues that were perfectly clear and he was very pissy about it. For example, when the party found out about an issue (in 3.0) with simulacra exceeding the power of their creators, he burst out with, "There's no rules for that!" (Rule: multiple empowerment of simulacrum. Doesn't work anymore for multiple reasons- simulacrum doesn't have numeric variables and you can't stack the same metamagic feat. But in 3.0 it worked fine.) Another example: the pcs were fighting a dragon that they thought was a shadow dragon, but then it breathed lightning. Pissy player: "Can you apply the half-dragon template to a dragon?" Me: Devilish grin. Pissy player: "That's so stupid. That's so against the rules." (Rule: a half-dragon dragon is specifically mentioned as a way to simulate crossbreeds in Savage Species.) So basically, don't challenge the dm if you don't understand how it works. Challenge the dm if you think he's using a double standard either for or against the pcs, or if he isn't treating all the pcs the same, or if he makes a major mistake or a ruling that invalidates a chunk of your character build. But always, [i]always[/i] accept that he may make rulings that you don't agree with. And if it's a big deal talk about it after the game's over or on a break, but let it go during the game. [/QUOTE]
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When should players challenge the DM and when should they be quiet?
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