Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Hriston" data-source="post: 6680105" data-attributes="member: 6787503">The same is true in 5E. Surprise only occurs if one side or another begins combat completely undetected making it somewhat of a corner case in most respects. Earlier editions seem to basically agree with this. In AD&amp;D, for example, you weren't supposed to roll for surprise unless one side was possibly undetected. If a party was approaching down a dungeon corridor bearing torches then the DM would rule out surprise. The main difference was that in AD&amp;D once the encounter began the parties were aware of each other. Surprise was the result of being undetected before the encounter. Once the encounter began you could use your surprise segments to avoid combat, but the other side was now aware of you.Presumably there was a moment before this in which the encounter could be avoided entirely. I think it was one of the Basic sets that actually first spelled out that this was possible if surprise existed. It seems that later editions have incorporated this by making the period of non-detection extend into at least the beginning of combat.One of the playtests I've looked at contained language along the lines of creatures that had been unaware of the approach of their opponents were surprised, but the present rules seem more consistent with the 3.5 concept that surprised creatures begin the encounter unaware.This creates the possibility that once surprise has been determined, the encounter may not happen at all.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hriston, post: 6680105, member: 6787503"] The same is true in 5E. Surprise only occurs if one side or another begins combat completely undetected making it somewhat of a corner case in most respects. Earlier editions seem to basically agree with this. In AD&D, for example, you weren't supposed to roll for surprise unless one side was possibly undetected. If a party was approaching down a dungeon corridor bearing torches then the DM would rule out surprise. The main difference was that in AD&D once the encounter began the parties were aware of each other. Surprise was the result of being undetected before the encounter. Once the encounter began you could use your surprise segments to avoid combat, but the other side was now aware of you. Presumably there was a moment before this in which the encounter could be avoided entirely. I think it was one of the Basic sets that actually first spelled out that this was possible if surprise existed. It seems that later editions have incorporated this by making the period of non-detection extend into at least the beginning of combat. One of the playtests I've looked at contained language along the lines of creatures that had been unaware of the approach of their opponents were surprised, but the present rules seem more consistent with the 3.5 concept that surprised creatures begin the encounter unaware. This creates the possibility that once surprise has been determined, the encounter may not happen at all. [/QUOTE]

Verification