COMING SOON! -- Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition! Level up your 5E game! The standalone advanced 5E tabletop RPG adds depth and diversity to the game you love!

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="the Jester" data-source="post: 7949882" data-attributes="member: 1210">So all this draws on a pretty extensive mix of material from various editions, and some of it is inference and deduction. If anyone wants a cite about a specific bit, please ask, and I will provide it if I can. Anyhow:So the energy planes aren't elemental planes per se, but are similar, and intermix with the elemental planes in ways that strongly resemble how the elemental planes work. For instance, opposite elemental planes don't 'touch' (e.g. water and fire don't make a paraelement), and as far as we know, the energy planes don't 'touch' either. So what differentiates them from the elemental planes? Well, for one thing, they aren't of substance (though whether you could consider fire to be a 'substance' is arguable). They seem to be significantly emptier than the elemental planes, too, with a much lower number and density of native inhabitants. And they are usually depicted as separate from the elemental planes, though I don't think that's a very strong argument- after all, we've seen multiple models of how the planes fit together over the years. Another argument lies in the fact that the energy planes seem to 'touch' all the elemental planes (forming quasi-elemental planes at the boundaries). I suspect strongly that there are also undiscovered quasi-elemental planes where these two touch the para-elemental planes; and I also suspect that there's another set of quasi-elemental planes, because there's (at least) a third energy plane- the plane of temporal energy, also called the plane of Time (or, in pre-3e cosmology, the demiplane of Time). So based on the structure of the planes, it seems probable that there is a whole set of Time + Element (or paraelement) quasielemental planes. I have no idea what they would be, but it seems like a cool area to speculate about and explore in future.Anyway, the energy planes do have inhabitants, though none have many. The Positive Energy Plane contains native ravids, the Negative Energy Plane is home to drelbs, trilloch, etc, and the plane of temporal energy contains a multitude of creatures, including tether beasts, time gliders, and, most germane to this discussion, time elementals (also sometimes referred to as time dimensionals). Now- those time elementals- does their existence imply positive and negative energy elementals (or dimensionals)? I would argue yes. And to back that up, I'll point first at the deep and long-established degree of symmetry in D&D's planar cosmologies, and then at some other examples- the energons, to start with. In 1e, we met the xag-ya and xeg-yi, the positive and negative energy versions of the energons. In the 3e Planar Handbook, we see a ton more- ones that represent other energy types, including fire and cold. And I am almost 100% certain that at some point we see negative fundamentals (maybe in Return to the Tomb of Horrors?). (Fundamentals are creatures that look like tiny bat-like scraps of elemental essence.)I don't think this holds much water. Not all undead are immune to necrotic (negative) energy, and most living things overload and explode if pumped full of positive energy. Negative energy does beget undead, and there is definitely a strong connection. But other undead are strongly connected to cold or disease. And there are other things that use negative energy, though it's not common. As far as the gods, according to the lore, almost no deities make their homes on the energy planes. Those that do are usually deep students of the energies, because otherwise they can't withstand them. I think of the energy planes as more likely to be part of the raw 'stuff' that the primordials created than part of the arrangement that the gods imposed.As for which, I don't think that has been detailed, since the energy planes weren't in the 4e cosmology that brought us primordials in the first place.Why wouldn't they be?I'm not quite clear on what you're asking here. IIRC, petitioners can't leave their Outer Plane without being destroyed, or maybe are destroyed forever if they do or something? Not so fiends and celestials. Why shouldn't they? They can have elemental traits too.  I don't think they especially relate to positive or negative energy. And as soon as you say "logically" when talking about the Far Realm, I think you're already on the wrong track. Are positive or negative energy in the Far Realm? Who knows? Probably? Maybe yes and no at the same time. Perhaps there is no answer.It's draining life. But when you're talking about mechanics from a single edition, I think you have to watch out for the tendency to read too much into them. The mechanic is there to show that they are 'eating' your life essence.Entropy works through negative energy/decay processes, among other things. Also through cold. So negative energy is one, but not the only, sign of entropy, and one, but not the only, way that entropy manifests. Probably because mortal humans fear the dark, and most information on the subjects has been reported by humans. Also, because so many undead use negative energy and are so tightly linked to the Shadowfell, it's easy to see how they could be conflated. It comes from the NEP. I posit that it entered the multiverse at or near the very beginning, as one ingredient among many. Think of the elements and material stuff as the "dry" ingredients (even though water is one of them) and the energies as the "wet" ingredients.</blockquote>

Verification