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Where does optimizing end and min-maxing begin? And is min-maxing a bad thing?
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<blockquote data-quote="doctorbadwolf" data-source="post: 7072636" data-attributes="member: 6704184"><p>Also,...</p><p></p><p>I'm wondering about a thing. </p><p></p><p>So...what exactly is wrong with avoiding letting the game "punish" the players for building a bunch of "dex monkeys"? Everyone, except me, seems to be on the same page here, and I'm at a loss as to where ya'll are coming from. </p><p></p><p>Like, what would be wrong with providing ways around the heavy climbing and swimming, or boulder pushing, or whatever? I mean, it's not a big issue for me, because I always make sure my character has some competence in a decent range of activities, but I'm curius what the mindset is, in the first place. </p><p></p><p></p><p>If I had a group of jugheads, and the adventure I picked ahead of time* featured a lot of Investigation and lore skill challenges, and a chase that was primarily going to challenge their agility and coordination, of course I'd tinker those challenges to not be a complete fish out of water goose chase? I don't understand why you wouldn't? What fun is there in running one type of adventure with a group designed for a completely different type of story? </p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>*I would never do this. I might have a short list of adventures that I'll choose from depending on the party, but I can't imagine running a game that isn't designed to be interesting for the player characters at the table. Obviously that includes challenging them, giving them the spotlight, giving them meaningful agency related to their character's goals, and obstacles in the way of achieving those goals, etc. </p><p></p><p></p><p>I'm currently running The Mark of Prophecy, from the back of the 4e Eberron Campaign Guide, to kick off a new/relaunched 5e Eberron campaign. The challenges mostly track fine into 5e with very little conversion work, and more importantly, the adventure as designed works really well for the player characters I had at the table.</p><p> </p><p>I also talk to the players beforehand to let them know what kind of challenges are my strong suite/preference, so they know that a brute character should probably still have Nature, or History, or Perception, or Insight, or <em>some</em> kind of skill for interaction and/or investigation/research. </p><p> </p><p></p><p></p><p>But, I also don't allow characters to be made separate from the group, outside of weird circumstances, and I discourage characters with no ties to the setting or campaign, or other player characters, etc.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="doctorbadwolf, post: 7072636, member: 6704184"] Also,... I'm wondering about a thing. So...what exactly is wrong with avoiding letting the game "punish" the players for building a bunch of "dex monkeys"? Everyone, except me, seems to be on the same page here, and I'm at a loss as to where ya'll are coming from. Like, what would be wrong with providing ways around the heavy climbing and swimming, or boulder pushing, or whatever? I mean, it's not a big issue for me, because I always make sure my character has some competence in a decent range of activities, but I'm curius what the mindset is, in the first place. If I had a group of jugheads, and the adventure I picked ahead of time* featured a lot of Investigation and lore skill challenges, and a chase that was primarily going to challenge their agility and coordination, of course I'd tinker those challenges to not be a complete fish out of water goose chase? I don't understand why you wouldn't? What fun is there in running one type of adventure with a group designed for a completely different type of story? *I would never do this. I might have a short list of adventures that I'll choose from depending on the party, but I can't imagine running a game that isn't designed to be interesting for the player characters at the table. Obviously that includes challenging them, giving them the spotlight, giving them meaningful agency related to their character's goals, and obstacles in the way of achieving those goals, etc. I'm currently running The Mark of Prophecy, from the back of the 4e Eberron Campaign Guide, to kick off a new/relaunched 5e Eberron campaign. The challenges mostly track fine into 5e with very little conversion work, and more importantly, the adventure as designed works really well for the player characters I had at the table. I also talk to the players beforehand to let them know what kind of challenges are my strong suite/preference, so they know that a brute character should probably still have Nature, or History, or Perception, or Insight, or [I]some[/I] kind of skill for interaction and/or investigation/research. But, I also don't allow characters to be made separate from the group, outside of weird circumstances, and I discourage characters with no ties to the setting or campaign, or other player characters, etc. [/QUOTE]
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Where does optimizing end and min-maxing begin? And is min-maxing a bad thing?
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