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Where does optimizing end and min-maxing begin? And is min-maxing a bad thing?
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<blockquote data-quote="Arial Black" data-source="post: 7074439" data-attributes="member: 6799649"><p>So I foolishly try to live my real life and when I come back there's been 100 posts about whether DMs should change the adventure to target either the PC's weaknesses or their strengths....</p><p></p><p>The first time I ever used point-buy in D&D was in order to have a legal PC for the Pathfinder organised play. I absolutely hated point-buy in both theory and execution but I wanted to play and point-buy was the only way.</p><p></p><p>So I came up with Malachi Silverclaw, a paladin who dumped both Int and Wis.</p><p></p><p>My next PC for organised play was born out of my frustrations with point-buy. I wanted to play a halfling bard/dervish dancer, and I realised that I could start with both Dex and Cha at 20. In order to do so I had to have the other four stats share the one remaining build point! The highest score you could buy was 18 and the lowest was 7. She started with 7/7/7/8/18/18. After assigning to stats and applying racial modifiers she started with Str 5 Dex 20 Con 8 Int 7 Wis 7 Cha 20. I then had to think of a way to play the little airhead, but that was easy!</p><p></p><p>The point is that I could have no expectation of DMs deliberately targetting either my weaknesses or my strengths because the DMs are all using the same pre-written adventures. The challenge here is all about risk/reward: does having a couple of great stats make up for having four bad ones?</p><p></p><p>Well....it depends! It depends on how you play. Specifically, you play in a way that maximises your strengths and minimises your weaknesses. <em>This</em> is the challenge!</p><p></p><p>As much as I resented having to dump FOUR stats in order to get the two I wanted, this is definitely only possible through point-buy!</p><p></p><p>Being made to use point-buy and then not having enough points to realise my concept, the choice that point-buy <em>forces</em> on me is to either be weaker in the stats I really need OR weaker in the stats I don't care about and which I could play in such a way as to minimise their potential disadvantages. Given that challenge I go for (in 5E terms) 16/16/16/8/8/8 over 13/13/13/12/12/12 every time.</p><p></p><p>And that challenge, the challenge to use those few points in the best way possible, motivates me to get the highest stats (or stat modifiers) as I possibly can.</p><p></p><p>And this is encouraged by point-buy! Demonstrating this is trivial: point-buy make me get my stats as high as possible, but when I'm allowed to freely choose my own scores (no rolling or point-buy or anything else) then I do <strong>not</strong> choose to give myself six 18s. With this freedom I have no pressure, no challenge to <em>choose</em> to have the best possible stats (six 18s), while point-buy challenges me to make the best use of my points.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Arial Black, post: 7074439, member: 6799649"] So I foolishly try to live my real life and when I come back there's been 100 posts about whether DMs should change the adventure to target either the PC's weaknesses or their strengths.... The first time I ever used point-buy in D&D was in order to have a legal PC for the Pathfinder organised play. I absolutely hated point-buy in both theory and execution but I wanted to play and point-buy was the only way. So I came up with Malachi Silverclaw, a paladin who dumped both Int and Wis. My next PC for organised play was born out of my frustrations with point-buy. I wanted to play a halfling bard/dervish dancer, and I realised that I could start with both Dex and Cha at 20. In order to do so I had to have the other four stats share the one remaining build point! The highest score you could buy was 18 and the lowest was 7. She started with 7/7/7/8/18/18. After assigning to stats and applying racial modifiers she started with Str 5 Dex 20 Con 8 Int 7 Wis 7 Cha 20. I then had to think of a way to play the little airhead, but that was easy! The point is that I could have no expectation of DMs deliberately targetting either my weaknesses or my strengths because the DMs are all using the same pre-written adventures. The challenge here is all about risk/reward: does having a couple of great stats make up for having four bad ones? Well....it depends! It depends on how you play. Specifically, you play in a way that maximises your strengths and minimises your weaknesses. [i]This[/i] is the challenge! As much as I resented having to dump FOUR stats in order to get the two I wanted, this is definitely only possible through point-buy! Being made to use point-buy and then not having enough points to realise my concept, the choice that point-buy [i]forces[/i] on me is to either be weaker in the stats I really need OR weaker in the stats I don't care about and which I could play in such a way as to minimise their potential disadvantages. Given that challenge I go for (in 5E terms) 16/16/16/8/8/8 over 13/13/13/12/12/12 every time. And that challenge, the challenge to use those few points in the best way possible, motivates me to get the highest stats (or stat modifiers) as I possibly can. And this is encouraged by point-buy! Demonstrating this is trivial: point-buy make me get my stats as high as possible, but when I'm allowed to freely choose my own scores (no rolling or point-buy or anything else) then I do [b]not[/b] choose to give myself six 18s. With this freedom I have no pressure, no challenge to [i]choose[/i] to have the best possible stats (six 18s), while point-buy challenges me to make the best use of my points. [/QUOTE]
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