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<blockquote data-quote="OB1" data-source="post: 7079681" data-attributes="member: 6796241">There are much easier ways to play an inept anything, simply make all the wrong choices in what you are doing.&nbsp; What I am talking about is the concept of making the thief who is trying to be great, but doesn't have the natural ability at the beginning of her career.&nbsp; This character, even when starting with a dex of 8 and an int of 10, will still make every choice possible to make the character as effective as possible.&nbsp; My point is that those players are working against themselves in 5e, and it certainly wasn't my intent to belittle.&nbsp; I personally play most video games on easy or narrative difficulty setting.&nbsp; Nothing wrong with that choice.&nbsp; And some games litterally tell you that choosing easy means that your character will hit harder, have more HP, and be hit less than the baseline.&nbsp; Basically, your character is being min-maxed!What I am trying to get at is that the designers of 5e figured out that the arms race between players who max out there characters combat ability and the designing of monsters to combat them was unwinnable.&nbsp; 10,000 minds working together on the internet for years after the books are released will always beat the designers, regardless of how tightly they try to balance everything.So instead, they said okay, if you want to make a mechanically superior PC, you will BE mechanically superior.&nbsp; That inevitably means the game will be less random and also easier.&nbsp; Just like getting magic weapons in 5e actually has a permanent positive effect, there are certain combinations of abilities with classes that does the same. If your players want mechanically hard fights, the best way to achieve that is to NOT min-max their characters!</blockquote>

[QUOTE="OB1, post: 7079681, member: 6796241"] There are much easier ways to play an inept anything, simply make all the wrong choices in what you are doing. What I am talking about is the concept of making the thief who is trying to be great, but doesn't have the natural ability at the beginning of her career. This character, even when starting with a dex of 8 and an int of 10, will still make every choice possible to make the character as effective as possible. My point is that those players are working against themselves in 5e, and it certainly wasn't my intent to belittle. I personally play most video games on easy or narrative difficulty setting. Nothing wrong with that choice. And some games litterally tell you that choosing easy means that your character will hit harder, have more HP, and be hit less than the baseline. Basically, your character is being min-maxed! What I am trying to get at is that the designers of 5e figured out that the arms race between players who max out there characters combat ability and the designing of monsters to combat them was unwinnable. 10,000 minds working together on the internet for years after the books are released will always beat the designers, regardless of how tightly they try to balance everything. So instead, they said okay, if you want to make a mechanically superior PC, you will BE mechanically superior. That inevitably means the game will be less random and also easier. Just like getting magic weapons in 5e actually has a permanent positive effect, there are certain combinations of abilities with classes that does the same. If your players want mechanically hard fights, the best way to achieve that is to NOT min-max their characters! [/QUOTE]

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