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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 4694606" data-attributes="member: 4937">Edena: I'm not exactly sure how I was unclear.  However, this is the homebrew feat I mentioned.  It's pretty straight forward, and should look pretty familiar.The only other homebrew thing I mentioned was a homebrew skill, "Tactics", which is a class skill for fighters and can be taken cross class by other classes.  It doesn't really effect the build for the Mongol Warrior, but I feel its appropriate given the high degree of tactical coordination displayed by the Horde.  They were generally much better organized than their foes, and generally relied on not just mobility, but superior command and control and unit discipline to defeat larger or better armed forces. It's not what I'd consider well play tested, but only in the sense that I don't like how it can add bunch of dice thrown to each round in the worst case.   At higher levels though, anyone who is trying to go the 'warlord' route would automatically succeed at most common checks.  I'd consider dropping the DC's of some checks just to accomplish that quicker.None of that though would seem to clarify my post.So, to clarify my post, I was drawing a contrast between the 17 feats that you felt created the image of a Rhohirrim, and the six or so that I felt were necessary (assuming of course we let the Riders of Rohan be more than 1st level fighters).  My 1st level mounted archer has Mounted Combat and Mounted Archery as feats.  This lets him move and fire effectively.  He also has a +10 bonus to Ride from Skill Focus (Ride), a combat saddle, +1 Dex bonus, and 4 ranks in ride.  It's only DC 5 to control a mount with your knees in order to fire an arrow, so our archer never fails at that or at fighting with his warhorse, and indeed can usually (75%) hang off the side of his horse to provide himself cover when fighting.  So he's good at what he does, even without any bonus feats, and can accomplish that trick from the movie of turning around in the saddle and shooting behind the horse without a problem.The 11 feats aren't necessary.But, on the other hand, I agree that he feels just a little bit cramped, as if he didn't quite fit the whole image of a nomadic tribal horse warrior.  Ideally, a couple of other feats would make him feel more well-rounded without feeling 'Monty Haulish'.  Where I'm going with this is, "Ok, 11 feats at first level might be more than a bit excessive, but is 1 feat at first level (and possibly 1-2 bonus feats depending on class and race) too strict.   Can we make up examples of fairly low level fighters that do seem to need something to do what they do?"One of the reasons for bringing up the Tactics skill, is often I think 3rd edition had a flaw of mistaking a common skill or ordinary manuever that you ought to be able to use even untrained (if not well), for a feat or feat tree.  If you'll notice, the Tactics skill lets heavy infantry - like a Macedonian Phalanx - do alot of what heavy infantry do without recourse to needing to front load a bunch of feats.  In other words, maybe the boys from Sparta didn't have 11 feats, they just all had a skill focus in Tactics that let them work together very well.</blockquote>

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