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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Arkhandus" data-source="post: 3306928" data-attributes="member: 13966">I don't know where all this 'monks are hard to kill' talk is coming from.  It's tough to make their Armor Class even respectable, let alone effective, and if they do that, their other abilities are surely suffering greatly from lack of attention (no infinite cash, feats, and stat boosts to spend on offense, defense, and utility).And they can't really boost their Hit Points well without neglecting stuff.  They need too many good ability scores to be effective, such that most monks will at least kinda suck compared to everyone else.  They can't focus on good Intelligence for skills unless they sacrifice what little combat potency or resilience they may otherwise have.Try playing a monk in a standard wealth or slightly-below-average-wealth campaign with typical point-buy stats or similar rolled stats (25-32 point buy is what I've encountered in various group's games).  Only in rare games with absurd point-buy totals or dice-rolling methods, with high wealth, would a monk do particularly well.  Also keep in mind that very little of the monk's perceived power and flexibility has anything to do with low- to mid-level monks.How would monks have loads of extra cash for miscellaneous equipment?  They need lots of not-so-cheap magic items to make their AC, attack rolls, and damage be any kind of decent.  Several of the items they need share the same body location slot, and are thus non-viable (or need to be made for other slots at greater expense, and specially commissioned by the monk beforehand).  Bracers of Armor are more expensive and limited than simple magic armor, and can't normally receive special armor abilities (though some books, like Arms & Equipment Guide, allow it).  Monks can't use shields without suffering ASF with some abilities (or losing some perhaps), and no magic items really replace a magic shield fully.  Monks need to pump Strength, Dexterity, Constitution, and Wisdom to really be effective, unlike any other class.My monk that focused on Dexterity and Wisdom (AC and saves, in other words), in a 32-point buy game, would vehemently debate the survivability of monks.  He's been beaten within an inch of his life in half or a third of the battles he's been in, done very little damage to enemies, and had poor luck at hitting anything in the first place.  Couldn't grapple worth a cr**, couldn't take a hit very well, couldn't dodge very often against equal-CR foes, and wasn't at all uber at chasing stuff or fighting spellcasters.  Enemies on horseback or with Fly spells still escaped him, enemies with bows still maimed him with rapid shot barrages, and he was still plenty vulnerable to magic missiles and summoned monsters.  Couldn't do much against the giants he fought on a couple of occasions (couldn't take many hits from them either), easily got beaten down by flanking rogues, and almost never managed to fight anything solo (always needed someone else to do the majority of damage, before the monk could die of accumulated wounds).</blockquote>

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