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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Merlion" data-source="post: 2660034" data-attributes="member: 10397">But there is. The rules. When I talk about these things I am talking...at least to start with...about the rules as they are written, without DM modifications. And part of my point is, if a DM has to do a lot of changing and finagling for a class to shine...or not to outshine others...then there is a balance problem in the rules as written.  This is a good point, and I think a problem within the system both for classes, and for specific things within each class. Specializing is almost always the best way to go in D&D, rarely are you rewarded for trying to be competent in multiple areas.(Except the Cleric which is mostly because it covers pretty much everything except Rogue stuff, and even some of that)   The thing about Sorcerer is a lot like the thing about Fighter. They arent really underpowered across the board, but they are compared to others of their kind.  The Sorcerer gained spontaneous casting but it was overcompensated for between the extremely limited spells known, and the slow aqquisition of new spell levels. Basically the Sorcerer is a variant Wizard that not quite enough thought was put into For the monk, I think the combat movement rules need to be losened up a bit so the Monk can really take advantage of their speed. I'm also begining to think monks should just have full BAB. I'd say its more like 7th level up, and then especially 9th level up. You've got Divine Power, Flame Strike, Slay Living..Funny thing is, a Bard is probably better at offensively enhancing the party than the Cleric is.. This is very true. the Cleric is among the only classes that can not just manage, but "shine" under almost any circumstances. But the rulebook is the foundation, and where everything comes from. The rules determine what you can and cannot do, mechanically, in the game. Unless you or the DM change them. No matter how good a player you are, a Rogue has a worse BAB than a Fighter, and a Cleric gets both melee ability and spells, unless you change the rules.And, if you need to change the rules to make a class be able to "shine" and/or to compete with...or not overshadow, other classes, theres a problemAlso bear in mind, many DMS are interested in changing the rules. They go by whats in the rulebook, as far as mechanics, and leave the rest to RP, but RP cant change what you can and cant do mechanically. This is an important point to. Clerics used to be walking band aids, but they arent anymore. And anyone who either never had that sterotype, or who has really looked at the new mechanics of the Cleric will know that  This is also a very important point, and why even in an RP heavy game, if your going to have combat at all, the mechanics matter. And class balance matters. I feel a character should generally be able to contribute to combat more often than not, *and* yet should not overshadow other characters. Thats why the classes need to be as balanced as possible.</blockquote>

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