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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 2673208" data-attributes="member: 2011">Opps. My bad. I did not notice that you did not give him a magic weapon, so I just used your numbers as is.When in position.He tumbles in, does a sneak attack against the Beholder. If he hits for sneak attack damage, the Beholder hits him with 3 or 4 rays on its next attack and he is toast.Or the 12 headed Hydra that hits him at least half of the time with +17 to hit and does about 90 points of damage in one round to him (if 6 of the 12 attacks hit). Last I checked, most 13th level Rogues do not have 90 hit points. Even with a 16 CON, a 13th level Rogue averages 87 hit points.Even if he survives the first round of a Hydra, is a 13th level Rogue REALLY going to stick around for round two?Your Rogue can dish out a lot of damage, but he cannot take it. And that is the crucial flaw of Rogues. Low AC. Low hit points. Lousy Fort and Will saves. The full round attack of most of these opponents will kill a 13th level Rogue in one round.Also note, many of these creatures have damage reduction or regeneration or other forms of defense that make combat damage against them less effective. For example, the Death Slaad has Damage Reduction 10 Lawful. Most Rogues will probably not be carrying Lawful weapons.Plus, some have offensive spells that a Rogue just cannot stand up against.The problem with the Rogue using his uber sneak attack is that he has to get in close and most of these creatures will turn a Rogue into jelly.Yup.You can do more damage with a Rogue. IF the Rogue survives.In order to do this mega-damage, the Rogue has to get in close. The Bard does not.THAT is the difference between Rogues and Bards. You tweeked out the Rogue and he is still dead by 3rd level.Bards are still more effective overall.</blockquote>

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