Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Shard O'Glase" data-source="post: 2673894" data-attributes="member: 1134">No class survies if all attacks are focussed on them.  The Ac of a rogue is about the same as any other class considering how armor works.  The rogue will likely have a mithral chain shirt and get +10 to AC from armor without enhancement, the fighter if he gets up to a 16 dex will have a +11 in mithral full plate, not much of a diference.  The fighter may have a shield but lots of fighters focus on the big sword style.(though they both can have a animated mithral shield at no penalty)  The fighter with a 16 con has 115 HP and is almost dead form the hydra as well, the fighter is likely more dead than the rogue from the beholder since the rogue probably has the 2nd best(monk is better) touch AC.  Virtually any class can be killed in one round using apropriate challenge level monsters.  Sure the rogue is more fragile in HP, but not by too large of a margin.  By 13th level its about 30 HP diference between them and a fighter or about 1 to 2 hits less than a fighter can take.  I'm really not that impressed by any classes durability at the 10+levels.  The GM's have to go out of there way not to slaughter every class in a single round.  The rogue maybe they have to coddle a bit more, but not as much a speople make out.IMO in combat rogues are better than bards, who delivers more to the party overall maybe the bard with a single level of rogue so he can get past traps.  While you think people are underestimating buffs, I think you are underestimating the power of large amounts of directed damage.  The ability to move in with conjunciton with the fighter and drop many foes in a single round shouldn't be underestimated.  Also the rogue benefits from spells like improved invis on an absurd level or a ring of blinking, not only will they gain an absurd level of protection they'll also become sneak attack machines.  So while the bards buffs are useless without a group, it important also to note how being in a gorup helps the rogue, it aint just flanking.Right now every party needs a rogue just for that one function of getting past traps so overall a rogue is more needed, its dumb and a DM can certianly remove traps form the game, but it the standard campaign you need a rogue to advance past traps.  Unless you want to make an absurd amount of noise and let summoned monsters set off all your traps.  I guess you can summon monsters and use a silence spell to open every chest and door but that doesn't seem practical.</blockquote>

Verification