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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 6111051" data-attributes="member: 4937">Alternately, the standard 'Cleave' feat (just one extra cleave per round) can be seen as growing more potent with level because the 20th level fighter is more likely to drop a ordc with each attack than the level 2 fighter is.&nbsp;&nbsp; Likewise, in the standard 3e progression of Cleave =&gt; Great Cleave =&gt; Superior Cleave, the power as a whole can be seen as being a single power which improves every n levels.&nbsp; The fact that we've turned the three selections of incremental power, into a small number of larger incremental steps doesn't really mean that one involves &quot;growing more potent with every level&quot; and the other doesn't.&nbsp;&nbsp; The only real difference is in how small we've made the incremental steps.&nbsp;&nbsp; Fewer big choices versus many smaller choices differs perhaps in a trade off between freedom and complexity, but it doesn't necessarily differ in the end result when it comes to capability.I generally agree except where the feat ends up creating rules that restrict everyone who doesn't have the feat from even attempting something.&nbsp; Cleave isn't really an 'exception to the rules'.&nbsp;&nbsp; It merely states the idea that &quot;For this character, you are better against a horde of foes than normal.&quot;&nbsp; It does that by something like an exception to the rules, but that doesn't mean that I think a feat like, &quot;You jump twice as far as normal&quot; is a bad feat merely because it amounts to a numeric mechanical bonus.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 6111051, member: 4937"] Alternately, the standard 'Cleave' feat (just one extra cleave per round) can be seen as growing more potent with level because the 20th level fighter is more likely to drop a ordc with each attack than the level 2 fighter is. Likewise, in the standard 3e progression of Cleave => Great Cleave => Superior Cleave, the power as a whole can be seen as being a single power which improves every n levels. The fact that we've turned the three selections of incremental power, into a small number of larger incremental steps doesn't really mean that one involves "growing more potent with every level" and the other doesn't. The only real difference is in how small we've made the incremental steps. Fewer big choices versus many smaller choices differs perhaps in a trade off between freedom and complexity, but it doesn't necessarily differ in the end result when it comes to capability. I generally agree except where the feat ends up creating rules that restrict everyone who doesn't have the feat from even attempting something. Cleave isn't really an 'exception to the rules'. It merely states the idea that "For this character, you are better against a horde of foes than normal." It does that by something like an exception to the rules, but that doesn't mean that I think a feat like, "You jump twice as far as normal" is a bad feat merely because it amounts to a numeric mechanical bonus. [/QUOTE]

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