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Message: <blockquote data-quote="KarinsDad" data-source="post: 1161504" data-attributes="member: 2011">Ok, I'll play Devil's Advocate.At first level, a Barbarian has 12 + CON bonus hit points. If you give him 14 CON and 12 DEX, he has 14 hit points and 11 AC. Throwing Studded Leather and a Large Wooden Shield into the mix, his AC goes to 16.His opponents will have maybe +3 to hit on average (some higher, some lower) and will typically do D8+2 damage.So, at AC 16, they hit 40% of the time for 6.5 points of damage. So, his 14 hit points (16 hit points AC 14 with Rage) will last 5.4 (non-raging) to 4.9 (raging) attacks on average.At AC 17 and 13 hit points, they hit 35% of the time for 6.5 points of damage. So, his 13 hit points (15 hit points AC 15 with Rage) will last 5.7 (non-raging) to 5.1 (raging) attacks on average.Overall, his chances of surviving combat are better at first level if he takes DEX over CON (not including the extra offensive round of raging which could dispose of an enemy).At second level, this starts leaning slightly in favor of CON, but still solidly in the DEX camp.22.5 hit points, AC 17 (better armor of chain shirt) and opponents hitting the same percentage 40% (since they too are one level higher) for the same damage (basically).So, they hit 40% of the time for 6.5 points of damage. So, his 22.5 hit points (26.5 hit points AC 15 with Rage) will last 8.7 (non-raging) to 8.15 (raging) attacks on average.At AC 18 and 20.5 hit points, they hit 35% of the time for 6.5 points of damage. So, his 20.5 hit points (24.5  hit points AC 16 with Rage) will last 9.0 (non-raging) to 8.4 (raging) attacks on average.As can be seen, DEX is still helping him more than CON with regard to number of attacks he can survive.Granted, as his levels get higher and AC starts taking a backseat to BAB, the CON will eventually overcome the DEX. But, this will take quite a few levels to even get to the break even point considering that a same level opponent can only boost his weapon and STR up with magic (typically) whereas the Barbarian can boost his armor, his shield, his DEX, and can even gain other protections like luck or deflection bonus items (i.e. there are more magical defensive options in the game than offensive ones, not that any given character will acquire them all).However, the real key here is that you have to SURVIVE to get to those higher levels and DEX allows you to do that slightly better than CON at lower to mid levels. At mid levels though, CON takes over. All of this is identical to the sum of the squares issue of Power Attack. There is an optimum AC point at which taking CON or DEX is preferable, DEX at low level when it significantly affects AC, CON at high level when DEX no longer significantly affects AC.In fact, I have been playing the ToEE computer game and I had 3 party members out of 5 take the Dodge feat at third level. The reason is that when your opponent has a 25% chance of hitting you lowered to a 20% chance of hitting you, you will average 20% less damage taken in a fight. Even when he has a 50% chance of hitting you, lowering it to 45% drops your damage taken by 10% in a fight (on average).</blockquote>

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