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Which parts of D&D came from Tolkien?
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<blockquote data-quote="Sacrosanct" data-source="post: 7268332" data-attributes="member: 15700"><p>This is absolutely right, and goes back to my earlier comment. D&D feels more like Tolkien because that's what most players are more familiar with and thus play the game to emulate the fantasy they know. My first fantasy experiences were the Harryhausen films (Sinbad) and books like Phantom Tollboth and the Prydain series. Not Tolkien. So our games felt a lot more like them and not Tolkien. Also, the rules did help push towards a more S&S feel than Tolkien feel based on racial limitations. D&D was designed to push towards a human centric world, where most of the PCs would be human. Things like level limits was a clear mechanical way of pushing towards that style of play (not to mention Gary's own words). So that was very much unlike Tolkien, who had all races pretty much equal. The only human in a party of 15 was Gandalf (and he wasn't even really human). In LoTR, Gimli and Legolas were just as spotlighted as Aragorn. And of course hobbits were the primary focus in all 4 books. In AD&D, you couldn't have Legolas and Gimli be as equal in power as their human counterparts for most classes by the middle of the trilogy, let alone by the end of it.</p><p></p><p>Conan the Barbarian came out shortly after I started playing, and since it also fit our preferred fantasy background, our games during that time were very much S&S, and not Tolkien at all. So it goes back to how individual gamers mold their gamestyle, and not so much D&D trying to emulate Tolkien more than any other influence.</p><p></p><p></p><p>*Edit* let me expound. In D&D Gandalf would be a 5th level MU (Old Dragon Magazine article reference). Certainly he was much more powerful than that in the books. Legolas couldn't be a ranger, and I doubt he had a 17 strength, so the best he could ever be is a 5th level fighter. Gimli could only be a 9th level fighter. Clearly, in pretty much every fantasy world, D&D doesn't emulate it very good. There are always going to be issues. And we as gamers tend to push the feel of the game towards what we feel most familiar with or what our preferences are. I would posit more gamers were/are familiar with Tokien (especially with the Hobbit cartoon bringing in tons of new younger gamers), so that's the feel they actively go for in D&D (it also explains why later editions of D&D feel and look more Tolkien than AD&D originally did). While a group like mine back in the day felt more like S&S and mythology because that was our influence and preference.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Sacrosanct, post: 7268332, member: 15700"] This is absolutely right, and goes back to my earlier comment. D&D feels more like Tolkien because that's what most players are more familiar with and thus play the game to emulate the fantasy they know. My first fantasy experiences were the Harryhausen films (Sinbad) and books like Phantom Tollboth and the Prydain series. Not Tolkien. So our games felt a lot more like them and not Tolkien. Also, the rules did help push towards a more S&S feel than Tolkien feel based on racial limitations. D&D was designed to push towards a human centric world, where most of the PCs would be human. Things like level limits was a clear mechanical way of pushing towards that style of play (not to mention Gary's own words). So that was very much unlike Tolkien, who had all races pretty much equal. The only human in a party of 15 was Gandalf (and he wasn't even really human). In LoTR, Gimli and Legolas were just as spotlighted as Aragorn. And of course hobbits were the primary focus in all 4 books. In AD&D, you couldn't have Legolas and Gimli be as equal in power as their human counterparts for most classes by the middle of the trilogy, let alone by the end of it. Conan the Barbarian came out shortly after I started playing, and since it also fit our preferred fantasy background, our games during that time were very much S&S, and not Tolkien at all. So it goes back to how individual gamers mold their gamestyle, and not so much D&D trying to emulate Tolkien more than any other influence. *Edit* let me expound. In D&D Gandalf would be a 5th level MU (Old Dragon Magazine article reference). Certainly he was much more powerful than that in the books. Legolas couldn't be a ranger, and I doubt he had a 17 strength, so the best he could ever be is a 5th level fighter. Gimli could only be a 9th level fighter. Clearly, in pretty much every fantasy world, D&D doesn't emulate it very good. There are always going to be issues. And we as gamers tend to push the feel of the game towards what we feel most familiar with or what our preferences are. I would posit more gamers were/are familiar with Tokien (especially with the Hobbit cartoon bringing in tons of new younger gamers), so that's the feel they actively go for in D&D (it also explains why later editions of D&D feel and look more Tolkien than AD&D originally did). While a group like mine back in the day felt more like S&S and mythology because that was our influence and preference. [/QUOTE]
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