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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ywain" data-source="post: 150769" data-attributes="member: 1420">"If the way I would do it, the fighter would kill all the rats in one round and get an extra attack against the vampire - that's enough of a benefit from his feats in my opinion. "So the Vampire sends the rats against the fighter rather than the wizard (dumb move) and the fighter only gets one attack?  Why bother taking Great Cleave.  In your system, under what circumstances would you get the extra attacks from Great Cleave during a Whirlwind Attack?  Sounds like a rip-off to me.  Definitely a house rule, in any case.Doc Moriarty"There is an easy solution."Ummmn, to a problem that hasn't been demonstrated to exist, actually.  Try playing by the core rules for a while and see if any problems arise.  I'm pretty sure that at most, this combination will a dramatic result maybe once every few campaigns."Unfortunately taking that attack with disrupt the flow of the whirlwind attack so the cleave has to be taken at the end of the attack."What about Great Cleave?  Does he get multiple attacks at the end of the WWA if he drops multiple foes?  Do these extra attacks come before or after his off-hand attacks?I mean really, with plain old regular Cleave a 10th level fighter gets at most one extra attack per round under very strict circumstances and it needs to be fixed.  A 10th level wizard can haste himself and cast two 10d6 fireballs per round and take out about 6 times (!) as many kobolds. Mass destruction was the sole purview of the mage in 1e and 2e.  In 3e the Fighter can (occassionally) pull his weight against the hordes.  I am really uncomfortable taking this away from the Fighter (and it is only the fighter you are taking it away from).</blockquote>

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