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Message: <blockquote data-quote="GreatLemur" data-source="post: 3326254" data-attributes="member: 28553">I share a lot of folks' misgivings about the Cleric.  They're obviously overpowered, and personally I think helping the other PCs is enough fun that you don't need to be bribed to do it.  I can't be alone in thinking it's as much fun to save somebody's ass as it is to hand it to them.  There are people who will happily play so-called support classes without this kind of imbalance.Also, the Cleric's martial focus always struck me as weird and inappropriate.  There really needs to be a divine Wizard-equivalent out there, with low BAB, little to no armor, and more spells (and the Cloistered Cleric doesn't really pull that off, although it is a cool variant).For that matter, can anyone give me a flavor justification for why Clerics aren't spontaneous casters?  Because I literally can't think of one.And then, of course, there's the whole weird bit of flavor-turned-mechanic that says that divine magic = healing and undead-wrangling.  In my opinion, divinely-powered classes ought to be hugely customizable, to reflect the diversity of the gods behind them.  Meanwhile, I don't really dig the idea that arcane magic--which can turn people into toads, for chrissakes--somehow just cannot close up people's wounds.  There no logic, there, just archetype protection.</blockquote>