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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
Who else is going to be a deserter when 4e comes out?
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<blockquote data-quote="WizarDru" data-source="post: 2514833" data-attributes="member: 151"><p>That's a valid opinion...I just happen to disagree. We've already seen what happens when you spread core rules over a few dozen supplements...you get a mess. I don't use House Rules, and I limit the number of supplements I use, regardless of which I buy.</p><p></p><p>The idea that MORE equals better is one I don't necessarily accept. I think D&D can handle higher levels better than they currently do: piling MORE rules and material on top of the existing framework does not suggest easing the DM's burden to me. 3e's core creators admitted that they didn't test 11th-20th level play with nearly the same rigor as lower level play, iirc, and it shows. Cobbling together suggestions for a 5 year-old issue of Dragon, a 3.0 supplement (that was near-3.5, but not quite there) and some rough guidelines from the MM don't take the place of an actual article or section similar to creating Epic Level spells from seeds, IMHO. It's a set of patches written by a host of authors, not a single guiding hand. It's inelegant, at best, and can be self-conflicting at worst (such as the changing monster categories). </p><p></p><p>While I'm not eagerly awaiting a 4e, I can see lots of room where things could be improved. Yes, no system is perfect...but your argument could just as easily be applied to AD&D as 3e. Some folks, however, don't want to have to use eight books to play the game, with post-its over whole sections of the rules that they've modified, ignored or changed. With enough modification, one can turn D&D in to True20, Grim Tales, Mutants and Masterminds...or Castles and Crusaders....or they could purchase those systems that, in and of themselves, are whole.</p><p></p><p>I personally don't believe that D&D can't be improved upon, any more than I did when I first cracked open the red book. I appreciate that some folks wouldn't want to drop coin on it, but I would want to judge it on it's own merits, rather than turn it down outright. WHich is exactly what I did with 3e, when I picked up the 3.0 PHB with no intention of actually playing...5 years ago.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="WizarDru, post: 2514833, member: 151"] That's a valid opinion...I just happen to disagree. We've already seen what happens when you spread core rules over a few dozen supplements...you get a mess. I don't use House Rules, and I limit the number of supplements I use, regardless of which I buy. The idea that MORE equals better is one I don't necessarily accept. I think D&D can handle higher levels better than they currently do: piling MORE rules and material on top of the existing framework does not suggest easing the DM's burden to me. 3e's core creators admitted that they didn't test 11th-20th level play with nearly the same rigor as lower level play, iirc, and it shows. Cobbling together suggestions for a 5 year-old issue of Dragon, a 3.0 supplement (that was near-3.5, but not quite there) and some rough guidelines from the MM don't take the place of an actual article or section similar to creating Epic Level spells from seeds, IMHO. It's a set of patches written by a host of authors, not a single guiding hand. It's inelegant, at best, and can be self-conflicting at worst (such as the changing monster categories). While I'm not eagerly awaiting a 4e, I can see lots of room where things could be improved. Yes, no system is perfect...but your argument could just as easily be applied to AD&D as 3e. Some folks, however, don't want to have to use eight books to play the game, with post-its over whole sections of the rules that they've modified, ignored or changed. With enough modification, one can turn D&D in to True20, Grim Tales, Mutants and Masterminds...or Castles and Crusaders....or they could purchase those systems that, in and of themselves, are whole. I personally don't believe that D&D can't be improved upon, any more than I did when I first cracked open the red book. I appreciate that some folks wouldn't want to drop coin on it, but I would want to judge it on it's own merits, rather than turn it down outright. WHich is exactly what I did with 3e, when I picked up the 3.0 PHB with no intention of actually playing...5 years ago. [/QUOTE]
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Who else is going to be a deserter when 4e comes out?
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